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Date: 16 Jun 2007 06:52:58
From: bernie
Subject: Bagel Boiling Question
I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
Bernie




 
Date: 20 Jun 2007 06:01:50
From: shane
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 19, 10:11 pm, bernie <bdig...@zianet.com > wrote:
> Coffee Contact wrote:
> > "bernie" <bdig...@zianet.com> wrote in message
> >news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>
> >>I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
> >>clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
>
> > Try to find a used small commercial countertop donut fryer, they are
> > about 24" square and quite shallow with
> > large screen basket and often 115 Volt. Just use water instead of oil.
>
> > Terry M
>
> Of course. Why didn't I think of that. It happens that I have one
> that I used in the Great Potato Flour Doughnut episode. Matter of fact,
> I have an automated trough type also.
> Bernie

Just curious, were the potato flour donuts not a success?



  
Date: 21 Jun 2007 17:16:38
From: bernie
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
shane wrote:
> On Jun 19, 10:11 pm, bernie <bdig...@zianet.com> wrote:
>
>>Coffee Contact wrote:
>>
>>>"bernie" <bdig...@zianet.com> wrote in message
>>>news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>>
>>>>I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
>>>>clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
>>
>>> Try to find a used small commercial countertop donut fryer, they are
>>>about 24" square and quite shallow with
>>> large screen basket and often 115 Volt. Just use water instead of oil.
>>
>>>Terry M
>>
>> Of course. Why didn't I think of that. It happens that I have one
>>that I used in the Great Potato Flour Doughnut episode. Matter of fact,
>>I have an automated trough type also.
>>Bernie
>
>
> Just curious, were the potato flour donuts not a success?
>

Oh, yeah, they were a success. I must have gained at least 8 lbs. The
project was set up in the kitchen of the warehouse to see if I could
duplicate the old "Spudnut" recipe. I did. The doughuts require a lot of
labor if done by hand, like bagels, and you can do 10 or 20 dozen as
easily as a couple dozen. Not worth doing for the amount we sell, but
with a little tweaking in the correct location (the new bakery) it will
make more sense. Hot, fresh, spudnuts by the dozen available at the
drive through ought to be worth doing. I don't want them done in the
coffeehouse because even with excellent HVAC systems you end up smelling
like a doughnut house and not a coffehouse.
Bernie


   
Date: 21 Jun 2007 23:55:55
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Howdy Bernie!
Sounds like the slogan for Blue Bell Ice Cream in Brenham, TX; 'We eat all
we can & sell the rest.' Once you get up & running on the semi-Spud Nuts
you'll have to let us buy some online. I loved the SN's I'd get in West
Seattle back in the 70's. Yum!
--
Robert Harmon
--
http://www.tinyurl.com/mb4uj - My coffee pages.

http://www.tinyurl.com/2tnv87 - My 'Guidelines For Newbies' page.

http://www.tinyurl.com/2cr3e2 - I have things for sale here.

"bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote in
> Oh, yeah, they were a success. I must have gained at least 8 lbs.
snipped
> Bernie




 
Date: 19 Jun 2007 13:49:13
From: shane
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 19, 12:26 pm, Marshall <mrf...@ihatespamearthlink.net > wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 09:48:06 -0700, shane <shane.ol...@juno.com>
> wrote:
>
> >I have made bagels following the instructions in the book "Breads from
> >the La Brea Bakery" by Nancy Silverton. It is a good book, goes into
> >technical/scientific reasons for doing things.
> >I used sourghdough starter and yeast. I added gluten to the bread
> >flour. I have had the best luck with North Dakota Mills flour.
> >I boiled them for a few seconds, the boiling step changes the physical
> >structure of the dough and it is an essential step to make a bagel,
> >otherwise you have donuts without sugar.
> >The bagels turn out as good or better than any bagel that I have
> >bought at any bakery.
>
> >Shane
>
> Interestingly, they don't actually sell bagels at the La Brea Bakery.
> The shop is very small, and they probably can't charge enough for
> bagels to make it pencil out.
>
> Marshall "plenty of space for cheese, though"

There is a pretzel receipe in the book too... I do recall something in
the copy about an old Jewish baker coming into the shop to make bagels
once in a while.
Interesting departure from many other bagel recepies is the boiling
last for only 20 second or so.
The book is a few years old, so things may have changed since it was
written.
The actual shop might be small, but they must have a factory
someplace. La Brea has come up with a way to sell their bread nation-
wide. Par-baking and freezing or some such technique.

Shane

Shane



  
Date: 20 Jun 2007 03:10:21
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 13:49:13 -0700, shane <shane.olson@juno.com >
wrote:

>There is a pretzel receipe in the book too... I do recall something in
>the copy about an old Jewish baker coming into the shop to make bagels
>once in a while.
>Interesting departure from many other bagel recepies is the boiling
>last for only 20 second or so.
>The book is a few years old, so things may have changed since it was
>written.
>The actual shop might be small, but they must have a factory
>someplace. La Brea has come up with a way to sell their bread nation-
>wide. Par-baking and freezing or some such technique.
>
>Shane

The bread baking business was sold off several years ago and has many
regional baking centers.

Nancy's current project is a pizza/sausage/pastry shop with Mario
Batali, here in L.A. Got to get myself over there.
http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/05/09/dining/09mozz.html

Marshall


  
Date: 19 Jun 2007 17:44:31
From: pltrgyst
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 13:49:13 -0700, shane <shane.olson@juno.com > wrote:

>.... La Brea has come up with a way to sell their bread nation-
>wide. Par-baking and freezing or some such technique.

H&H Bagels has been doing that for many years.

-- Larry


 
Date: 19 Jun 2007 09:48:06
From: shane
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 19, 11:14 am, DavidMLewis <DavidMLe...@mac.com > wrote:
> On Jun 16, 2:14 pm, Travesso <cpaso...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I would love a great bagel recipe. All the bagels in Jacksonville are
> > so-so.
> > The recipes I have found online are a bit so-so too.
>
> One thing of which you should be aware is that a true bagel recipe is
> almost impossible to make by hand. Not like espresso, which is
> actually impossible to make without a machine, but almost. My cousin
> has a good bagel bakery here in town (Santa Cruz, California). He uses
> a very high-gluten flour, and literally a tablespoon of yeast for a
> hundred-pound sack of flour. It takes a five-horsepower hook seven
> minutes, as I recall, to beat the stuff into submission. Aside from
> the boiling (when Noah's, which steams their bagels, started in New
> York, one of the old bagel bakeries had an ad campaign saying "steam
> is for dry cleaners"), fairly long proofing is essential for a proper
> chewy bagel. One of the reasons they're fattening is that a good bagel
> weighs a quarter of a pound or thereabouts.
>
> Best,
> David

I have made bagels following the instructions in the book "Breads from
the La Brea Bakery" by Nancy Silverton. It is a good book, goes into
technical/scientific reasons for doing things.
I used sourghdough starter and yeast. I added gluten to the bread
flour. I have had the best luck with North Dakota Mills flour.
I boiled them for a few seconds, the boiling step changes the physical
structure of the dough and it is an essential step to make a bagel,
otherwise you have donuts without sugar.
The bagels turn out as good or better than any bagel that I have
bought at any bakery.

Shane



  
Date: 19 Jun 2007 17:26:49
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 09:48:06 -0700, shane <shane.olson@juno.com >
wrote:

>I have made bagels following the instructions in the book "Breads from
>the La Brea Bakery" by Nancy Silverton. It is a good book, goes into
>technical/scientific reasons for doing things.
>I used sourghdough starter and yeast. I added gluten to the bread
>flour. I have had the best luck with North Dakota Mills flour.
>I boiled them for a few seconds, the boiling step changes the physical
>structure of the dough and it is an essential step to make a bagel,
>otherwise you have donuts without sugar.
>The bagels turn out as good or better than any bagel that I have
>bought at any bakery.
>
>Shane

Interestingly, they don't actually sell bagels at the La Brea Bakery.
The shop is very small, and they probably can't charge enough for
bagels to make it pencil out.

Marshall "plenty of space for cheese, though"


 
Date: 19 Jun 2007 09:19:05
From: DavidMLewis
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 17, 4:55 am, dcrehr <dcr...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On this I take issue. Are you telling me that onion bagels, which
> I've eaten regularly for more than 50 years (way long before bagels
> were available everywhere - even with the Sara Lee label) are
> abominations? Garlic bagels? Salt bagels?
>
Matter of timing. To my mother, may her name be for a blessing,
anything but a plain water bagel was an abomination. And you didn't
want to get her started about egg bagels, believe me. We live in a
looser world.

Best,
David



 
Date: 19 Jun 2007 09:14:37
From: DavidMLewis
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 16, 2:14 pm, Travesso <cpaso...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> I would love a great bagel recipe. All the bagels in Jacksonville are
> so-so.
> The recipes I have found online are a bit so-so too.

One thing of which you should be aware is that a true bagel recipe is
almost impossible to make by hand. Not like espresso, which is
actually impossible to make without a machine, but almost. My cousin
has a good bagel bakery here in town (Santa Cruz, California). He uses
a very high-gluten flour, and literally a tablespoon of yeast for a
hundred-pound sack of flour. It takes a five-horsepower hook seven
minutes, as I recall, to beat the stuff into submission. Aside from
the boiling (when Noah's, which steams their bagels, started in New
York, one of the old bagel bakeries had an ad campaign saying "steam
is for dry cleaners"), fairly long proofing is essential for a proper
chewy bagel. One of the reasons they're fattening is that a good bagel
weighs a quarter of a pound or thereabouts.

Best,
David



 
Date: 18 Jun 2007 08:51:14
From: Coffee Contact
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question

"bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote in message
news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?

Try to find a used small commercial countertop donut fryer, they are
about 24" square and quite shallow with
large screen basket and often 115 Volt. Just use water instead of oil.

Terry M




  
Date: 19 Jun 2007 21:11:48
From: bernie
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Coffee Contact wrote:
> "bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com> wrote in message
> news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>
>>I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
>>clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
>
>
> Try to find a used small commercial countertop donut fryer, they are
> about 24" square and quite shallow with
> large screen basket and often 115 Volt. Just use water instead of oil.
>
> Terry M
>
>

Of course. Why didn't I think of that. It happens that I have one
that I used in the Great Potato Flour Doughnut episode. Matter of fact,
I have an automated trough type also.
Bernie


 
Date: 17 Jun 2007 13:34:32
From: dcrehr
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
What I'd REALLY like to find here in Los Angeles is a bagel topping
that I can find anywhere in Baltimore.... Whitefish salad.

This is whitefish (smoked fish with a golden skin you can find at a
good delicatessen) that is mushed up... with SOMETHING added to it
(oil, mayo, sour cream.... I wish I knew). My goyische wife loves it
even more than I. Whenever we go East to visit family, we freeze some
and bring it back.

Nowhere to be found in L.A. I once saw something called Whitefish
Salad at Canter's in the Fairfax District, but it wasn't the same.

I wouldn't eat it on a blueberry bagel though.

Onion pletzl! Oy. Is my mouth watering.

......DR




  
Date: 17 Jun 2007 19:46:44
From: Boron Elgar
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Sun, 17 Jun 2007 13:34:32 -0700, dcrehr <dcrehr@hotmail.com > wrote:

>What I'd REALLY like to find here in Los Angeles is a bagel topping
>that I can find anywhere in Baltimore.... Whitefish salad.
>
>This is whitefish (smoked fish with a golden skin you can find at a
>good delicatessen) that is mushed up... with SOMETHING added to it
>(oil, mayo, sour cream.... I wish I knew). My goyische wife loves it
>even more than I. Whenever we go East to visit family, we freeze some
>and bring it back.
>
>Nowhere to be found in L.A. I once saw something called Whitefish
>Salad at Canter's in the Fairfax District, but it wasn't the same.
>
>I wouldn't eat it on a blueberry bagel though.
>
>Onion pletzl! Oy. Is my mouth watering.
>
>......DR


Actually, Canter's is pretty good, but try this. It is a recipe from
Joan Nathan.

Boron

* Exported from MasterCook Mac *

Recipe By : Joan Nathan and Mark Siegel
Serving Size : 10 Preparation Time :0:30
Categories : seafood Jewish

Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method
-------- ------------ --------------------------------
1 4 pound smoked whitefish
5 stalks celery -- strings removed
2 cups sour cream (approximately)
3 tablespoons mayonnaise
Freshly ground pepper to taste
2 tablespoons snipped fresh dill
2 tablespoons chopped parsley
Garnish: sprigs of fresh dill and/or
parsley

Keeping the skin of the whitefish intact and the head still attached,
carefully remove the bones from the whitefish and place the meat in a
mixing bowl. Dice the celery and combine with the whitefish, along
with 1 cup of the sour cream, the mayonnaise, and the pepper. Add the
dill and parsley and as much more sour cream as it wanted. Stuff the
mixture back into the skin of the whitefish, remaking the shape of a
fish.

Garnish with additional dill and parsley.
Yield: Enough for at least 10 people I particularly like this version
of whitefish salad, because there is no filler in it. Mark, a
political consultant who served in the Carter White House, makes it
for break-the-fast as well as during the year brunches.
This is a nice salad that can be made with other smoked fish such as
smoked trout!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Per serving: 36 Calories; 3g Fat (82% calories from fat); 1g Protein;
1g Carbohydrate; 3mg Cholesterol; 68mg Sodium

NOTES : "Jewish Cooking In America" by Joan Nathan


  
Date: 17 Jun 2007 17:58:35
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Mayo. At least that's what is says on the containers they sell at Costco of
Acme whitefish salad and Acme is a very respectable Brooklyn smoked fish
firm. Smoked whitefish and mayo. That's all it is.



"dcrehr" <dcrehr@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182112472.509249.315690@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> What I'd REALLY like to find here in Los Angeles is a bagel topping
> that I can find anywhere in Baltimore.... Whitefish salad.
>
> This is whitefish (smoked fish with a golden skin you can find at a
> good delicatessen) that is mushed up... with SOMETHING added to it
> (oil, mayo, sour cream.... I wish I knew). My goyische wife loves it
> even more than I. Whenever we go East to visit family, we freeze some
> and bring it back.
>
> Nowhere to be found in L.A. I once saw something called Whitefish
> Salad at Canter's in the Fairfax District, but it wasn't the same.
>
> I wouldn't eat it on a blueberry bagel though.
>
> Onion pletzl! Oy. Is my mouth watering.
>
> ......DR
>
>




   
Date: 17 Jun 2007 18:39:49
From: Moka Java
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Jack Denver wrote:
> Mayo. At least that's what is says on the containers they sell at Costco of
> Acme whitefish salad and Acme is a very respectable Brooklyn smoked fish
> firm. Smoked whitefish and mayo. That's all it is.
>

Yeah, mayo. The Costco stuff is a bit too homogenized but at $6.99 for
a 2# tub it's hard to justify buying a whole whitefish, skin, bones,
fins, head, fat and oil included, at $10 a #. Add some finely chopped
onion and a bit of mustard powder to make it more interesting.

R "tuna salad? who eats tuna salad?" TF


 
Date: 17 Jun 2007 05:45:51
From: dcrehr
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
And when eating a soft boiled egg, ALWAYS crack the shell on the small
end. ;)

DR


On Jun 17, 5:33 am, "Jack Denver" <nunuv...@netscape.net > wrote:
> Onion, garlic & salt are less bad than blueberry and sun-dried tomato and
> cinnamon-raisin but they aren't that good either.....



 
Date: 17 Jun 2007 04:55:09
From: dcrehr
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On this I take issue. Are you telling me that onion bagels, which
I've eaten regularly for more than 50 years (way long before bagels
were available everywhere - even with the Sara Lee label) are
abominations? Garlic bagels? Salt bagels?

If you want to get into a real debate... how about discussing the
proper way of heating them? Slice in half and toast? or leave whole
and warm (in an oven, NOT a microwave) and THEN slice?

And what to put on them? If it ain't lox, it ain't lox & bagels (and
cream cheese, of course). And, do you also add fresh sliced onion &
tomato. Or are those abominations too?

DR


On Jun 16, 9:39 am, "Jack Denver" <nunuv...@netscape.net > wrote:
> The two are mutually exclusive - there are three proper bagels varieties-
> plain, sesame, poppy. The rest are all abominations -






  
Date: 17 Jun 2007 15:44:29
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Sun, 17 Jun 2007 04:55:09 -0700, dcrehr <dcrehr@hotmail.com > wrote:

>On this I take issue. Are you telling me that onion bagels, which
>I've eaten regularly for more than 50 years (way long before bagels
>were available everywhere - even with the Sara Lee label) are
>abominations? Garlic bagels? Salt bagels?
>
>If you want to get into a real debate... how about discussing the
>proper way of heating them? Slice in half and toast? or leave whole
>and warm (in an oven, NOT a microwave) and THEN slice?
>
>And what to put on them? If it ain't lox, it ain't lox & bagels (and
>cream cheese, of course). And, do you also add fresh sliced onion &
>tomato. Or are those abominations too?
>
>DR

I'm not put off by bizarre bagel add-ins being on the menu. I just
don't order them. Even Goldsteins, which I think is first rate, has
"chocolate chip bagels."

O.K., I sort of take that back. I did gag once when I saw someone in
the old Colorado Blvd. shop order a chocolate chip bagel with lox
spread. He and his girl friend seemed to like it, though.

Oh, and just to stay on topic. Goldsteins does serve Supreme Bean
coffee.

Marshall


  
Date: 17 Jun 2007 14:03:50
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Sort of reminds me of the espresso argument - steam powered machines
produced "espresso" before the pump machine & Gaggia, Illy, et al, redefined
the genre. Some folks value semantics more than taste, or so it seems. (-;}
--
Robert Harmon
--
My coffee pages. - http://www.tinyurl.com/mb4uj

My 'Guidelines For Newbies' - http://www.tinyurl.com/2tnv87

Gaggia Classic; a great machine! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2enxjo

Nuova Simonelli Mac & grinder price cut! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2aogu2

"dcrehr" <dcrehr@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182081309.536966.153210@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> On this I take issue. Are you telling me that onion bagels, which
> I've eaten regularly for more than 50 years (way long before bagels
> were available everywhere - even with the Sara Lee label) are
> abominations? Garlic bagels? Salt bagels?
>
> If you want to get into a real debate... how about discussing the
> proper way of heating them? Slice in half and toast? or leave whole
> and warm (in an oven, NOT a microwave) and THEN slice?
>
> And what to put on them? If it ain't lox, it ain't lox & bagels (and
> cream cheese, of course). And, do you also add fresh sliced onion &
> tomato. Or are those abominations too?
>
> DR
>
>
> On Jun 16, 9:39 am, "Jack Denver" <nunuv...@netscape.net> wrote:
>> The two are mutually exclusive - there are three proper bagels varieties-
>> plain, sesame, poppy. The rest are all abominations -
>
>
>
>




   
Date: 17 Jun 2007 11:14:41
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
No - blueberry bagels are from the same school as blueberry hazelnut
flavored coffee - there is an authentic pure tradition and then there are
ersatz bubble gum flavored pretenders filled with artificial ingredients.
This is not about semantics, it's about keeping it real. Unfortunately, a
lot of folks are so cut off from the tradition that they don't know what's
real and what ain't.



"Robert Harmon" <r_h_harmon@Zhotmail.com > wrote in message
news:abbdi.2101$ZY1.1842@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Sort of reminds me of the espresso argument - steam powered machines
> produced "espresso" before the pump machine & Gaggia, Illy, et al,
> redefined the genre. Some folks value semantics more than taste, or so it
> seems. (-;}
> --
> Robert Harmon
>



  
Date: 17 Jun 2007 08:33:01
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Onion, garlic & salt are less bad than blueberry and sun-dried tomato and
cinnamon-raisin but they aren't that good either. If you want something with
onions, get a bialy or an onion board ("pletzl"). To me the onions and
garlic always taste burned and acrid and salt belongs on a pretzel.

Your 2nd question was a trick - bagels should be eaten fresh so there is no
need to reheat.

Lox (or actually nova unless you want a salt overdose) w/ accompaniments is
fine although I do mine open face and not as a sandwich. When I said
"sandwich" I meant using a bagel as the bread for your typical luncheon
meats such as the sacrilegious ham and cheese on a bagel.

"dcrehr" <dcrehr@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182081309.536966.153210@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> On this I take issue. Are you telling me that onion bagels, which
> I've eaten regularly for more than 50 years (way long before bagels
> were available everywhere - even with the Sara Lee label) are
> abominations? Garlic bagels? Salt bagels?
>
> If you want to get into a real debate... how about discussing the
> proper way of heating them? Slice in half and toast? or leave whole
> and warm (in an oven, NOT a microwave) and THEN slice?
>
> And what to put on them? If it ain't lox, it ain't lox & bagels (and
> cream cheese, of course). And, do you also add fresh sliced onion &
> tomato. Or are those abominations too?
>
> DR
>
>
> On Jun 16, 9:39 am, "Jack Denver" <nunuv...@netscape.net> wrote:
>> The two are mutually exclusive - there are three proper bagels varieties-
>> plain, sesame, poppy. The rest are all abominations -
>
>
>
>




   
Date: 17 Jun 2007 09:43:19
From: Moka Java
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Jack Denver wrote:
> Onion, garlic & salt are less bad than blueberry and sun-dried tomato and
> cinnamon-raisin but they aren't that good either. If you want something with
> onions, get a bialy or an onion board ("pletzl"). To me the onions and
> garlic always taste burned and acrid and salt belongs on a pretzel.
>
> Your 2nd question was a trick - bagels should be eaten fresh so there is no
> need to reheat.
>
> Lox (or actually nova unless you want a salt overdose) w/ accompaniments is
> fine although I do mine open face and not as a sandwich. When I said
> "sandwich" I meant using a bagel as the bread for your typical luncheon
> meats such as the sacrilegious ham and cheese on a bagel.
>

Or worse, with pastrami and melted swiss. I remember salt bagels from
"old world" NYC but onion and garlic bagels seem to be a suburban
innovations. Even the kosher shops around here sell a wide variety
including blueberry, french toast, rye, spinach, etc. Flagels are a
recent innovation to appeal to the low carb crowd who scoop out the
center of the bagel. Basically a flattened bagel, about 1/3 the
thickness of a standard bagel, more crust and less dough. A pumpkin
seed flagel is really quite good. A well made cinnamon raisin bagel is
less of an abomination if you consider it a not so sweet pastry rather
than a proper bagel.

The bagel shop closest to my office is in a predominantly Spanish
neighborhood. The business was purchased by a Korean couple a few years
ago. There was a period of adjustment but the multi-ethic staff is
pleasant and service oriented.

I can't find a decent bialy on Long Island.

R "gotta get to Kossar's" TF


    
Date: 17 Jun 2007 11:34:30
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Even the salt bagel I think is just an echo of the soft pretzel and not
"authentic" but it's harmless enough.

Kossars is the last bastion of the bialy. Mimi Sheraton wrote a great book
where she went all over the world (even to Bialystok) in search of an
authentic bialystoker kuchen (the full name of the bialy) beyond Kossars and
in the end couldn't find any because those who baked them were mostly dead.
My personal favorite at Kossar's is the onion pletzl, which puts any "flagl"
to shame.

There aren't that many Jews of this generation who want to wake up in the
middle of the night to work as bakers so a lot of the traditional Jewish
bagel and other bakeries are now owned by other (mostly immigrant) ethnic
groups. The Koreans won't last more than one generation in the business
either - their kids will have their college tuition paid for by bagels and
they'll become orthodontists and accountants.



"Moka Java" <rtwatches@fishyahoo.com > wrote in message
news:5dks71F35lr63U1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>
> Or worse, with pastrami and melted swiss. I remember salt bagels from
> "old world" NYC but onion and garlic bagels seem to be a suburban
> innovations. Even the kosher shops around here sell a wide variety
> including blueberry, french toast, rye, spinach, etc. Flagels are a
> recent innovation to appeal to the low carb crowd who scoop out the center
> of the bagel. Basically a flattened bagel, about 1/3 the thickness of a
> standard bagel, more crust and less dough. A pumpkin seed flagel is
> really quite good. A well made cinnamon raisin bagel is less of an
> abomination if you consider it a not so sweet pastry rather than a proper
> bagel.
>
> The bagel shop closest to my office is in a predominantly Spanish
> neighborhood. The business was purchased by a Korean couple a few years
> ago. There was a period of adjustment but the multi-ethic staff is
> pleasant and service oriented.
>
> I can't find a decent bialy on Long Island.
>
> R "gotta get to Kossar's" TF




 
Date: 16 Jun 2007 15:52:47
From: Barutan Seijin
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Am 16 Jun 2007, Dan Bollinger schrieb:



> Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw
> it on 'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.

Crappy commercial bakeries do it that way, yes. Ones that make bagels
boil them.

If it's not boiled, it's merely a toroid shaped roll.


--
barutanseijin@gmail.com


 
Date: 16 Jun 2007 14:14:38
From: Travesso
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 16, 8:52 am, bernie <bdig...@zianet.com > wrote:
> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
> Bernie

I would love a great bagel recipe. All the bagels in Jacksonville are
so-so.
The recipes I have found online are a bit so-so too.



  
Date: 16 Jun 2007 18:40:23
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
There is not much to an authentic bagel - this is the food of the eastern
european poor - they didn't have any fancy ingredients available, not even
oil.

Here it is:

http://www.foodreference.com/html/bagels.html

To get it just right, you need high gluten flour and malt syrup. There is
so little to this recipe that any substitution will change the taste and
texture.







"Travesso" <cpasoren@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182028478.881542.210710@m36g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> On Jun 16, 8:52 am, bernie <bdig...@zianet.com> wrote:
>> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
>> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
>> Bernie
>
> I would love a great bagel recipe. All the bagels in Jacksonville are
> so-so.
> The recipes I have found online are a bit so-so too.
>
>




 
Date: 16 Jun 2007 09:50:17
From: AyTee
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Jun 16, 5:52 am, bernie <bdig...@zianet.com > wrote:
> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
> Bernie

The Bagel Barn (probably defunct) near my childhood home in NJ boiled
them in a big pot. I don't know anything else about the preparation or
recipes, but they were delicious traditional hard bagels, not the
bagel-like objects that are now common.

Andy



 
Date: 16 Jun 2007 12:03:12
From: Moka Java
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
bernie wrote:
> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
> Bernie

The bagel shops around here (there are 3 w/in 5 minutes) all use large,
relatively shallow pots that look to be about 3' in diameter. The
bagels are formed by machine and dropped into the water then scooped out
with a hand strainer.

http://www.nyc24.org/2002/issue01/story02/page04.asp

I'm with Jack, there's bagel overload around here. Flagels, bialys and
onion boards are much more interesting. And then there's Kossar's . . .

R "worth the trip" TF


 
Date: 16 Jun 2007 09:39:51
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
A large gas kettle - doesn't need to be tilting - you throw the bagels in
and then skim them off when they rise to the top a minute or 2 later.

http://cgi.ebay.com/40-Gallon-Vulcan-Hart-Gas-Commercial-Soup-Kettle-GKL-40_W0QQitemZ250130927358QQihZ015QQcategoryZ57084QQcmdZViewItem

You could improvise something with a big stock pot and a high BTU turkey
fryer/ candy stove/ wok burner - it needs to be low enough to work
comfortably and return to the boil quickly - large pot on stove will be too
high to reach and too slow.


"bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote in message
news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
> Bernie




  
Date: 17 Jun 2007 01:43:41
From: D. Ross
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question


 
Date: 16 Jun 2007 09:26:39
From: Dan Bollinger
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw it on
'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.


"bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote in message news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No clue
> from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
> Bernie



  
Date: 16 Jun 2007 14:30:20
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
On Sat, 16 Jun 2007 09:26:39 -0500, "Dan Bollinger"
<danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com > wrote:

>Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw it on
>'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.

Their products bear the same relationship to real bagels as Folgers
does to your home roast. No bite, no stretch, no crust. Just muffins
with a hole in the middle.

Marshall


   
Date: 16 Jun 2007 09:32:57
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
"Marshall" <mrfuss@ihatespamearthlink.net > wrote in message
news:ess773tvps1l862igk2b8r8l5nmq8nr92d@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 16 Jun 2007 09:26:39 -0500, "Dan Bollinger"
> <danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com> wrote:
>
>>Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw it
>>on
>>'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.
>
> Their products bear the same relationship to real bagels as Folgers
> does to your home roast. No bite, no stretch, no crust. Just muffins
> with a hole in the middle.
>
> Marshall

We used to have a local bagel bakery that did things right, and had many
different varieties. The operation changed hands at least 4 times during 10
years, a testament to how hard it is to make money with those labor
intensive things, which won't sell beyond a certain (fairly low) price.
Several years ago the operation sold and is no longer a bagel bakery.

I used to be a regular customer, which at times played havoc with my weight.
I finally hit upon a strategy which allowed me to buy them but not gain
weight from eating them. It was simple. I'd take advantage of the "bakers
dozen for the price of 12" deal, rather common with purveyors of bagels.
I'd eat the first one then put the other 12 in the freezer. About 6 months
later, after they were all freezer burned, I'd toss them in the trash and go
back to the bakery to buy another 13, and the process would repeat.

ken




    
Date: 16 Jun 2007 12:39:50
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
The two are mutually exclusive - there are three proper bagels varieties-
plain, sesame, poppy. The rest are all abominations - the bagel equivalent
of hazelnut vanilla blueberry flavored coffee. I'd trade all the sun dried
tomato bagels in the whole world for one hot St. Viateur sesame bagel.

BTW, a bagel is not something that you slice in half in order to make a
sandwich. A proper bagel has a great big hole in the middle and makes a
lousy sandwich bread. You make a sandwich on a roll or on two slices of
bread. Bernie, if you are planning to make sandwiches, I'd much rather that
you bake bolillos for tortas - this fits in with your location and the
"Slow Food" idea so much better than an anonymous globalized bagel sandwich
that you could buy at McDonalds in Iowa or Helsinki.


http://www.stviateurbagel.com/



"Ken Fox" <morceaudemerdeThisMerdeGoes@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:5die39F32giv5U1@mid.individual.net...
> "Marshall" <mrfuss@ihatespamearthlink.net> wrote in message
> We used to have a local bagel bakery that did things right, and had many
> different varieties.




     
Date: 17 Jun 2007 12:46:36
From: John LaBella
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
In article <aqydnb67_ILLj-nbnZ2dnUVZ_o6gnZ2d@comcast.com >,
nunuvyer@netscape.net says...
> "Slow Food" idea so much better than an anonymous globalized bagel sandwich
> that you could buy at McDonalds in Iowa or Helsinki.
>
>
I am sorry being in the Armpit of the mid west ... I can attest the
McDonalds here (IOWA) don't have that big city varient of a Bagel -
anonymous or globalised. Oh for civilisation....

They didn't have a *$ until about 2 years ago now there are 5!
This is the place that a coffee wholesaler (yep we get our coffee from
Chicago once a week) and the people round here don't like fancy coffee -
its too strong.





      
Date: 17 Jun 2007 09:43:19
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
You ain't missing much. Here is the "secret recipe":

http://www.recipezaar.com/150531

Some notes on authenticity:

1. The bagels must be the mushy frozen kind that have never been boiled.
Lenders OK.

2. The cheese must be pasteurized process cheese food. No real cheese
please.

3. The steak must be the chopped and formed kind. Real meat has no place in
this recipe.

"John LaBella" <blank@dev.com > wrote in message
news:MPG.20dee92111d91f949896e3@netnews.mchsi.com...
> In article <aqydnb67_ILLj-nbnZ2dnUVZ_o6gnZ2d@comcast.com>,
> nunuvyer@netscape.net says...
>> "Slow Food" idea so much better than an anonymous globalized bagel
>> sandwich
>> that you could buy at McDonalds in Iowa or Helsinki.
>>
>>
> I am sorry being in the Armpit of the mid west ... I can attest the
> McDonalds here (IOWA) don't have that big city varient of a Bagel -
> anonymous or globalised. Oh for civilisation....
>
> They didn't have a *$ until about 2 years ago now there are 5!
> This is the place that a coffee wholesaler (yep we get our coffee from
> Chicago once a week) and the people round here don't like fancy coffee -
> its too strong.
>
>
>
>




     
Date: 16 Jun 2007 16:19:35
From: bernie
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Jack Denver wrote:
> The two are mutually exclusive - there are three proper bagels varieties-
> plain, sesame, poppy. The rest are all abominations - the bagel equivalent
> of hazelnut vanilla blueberry flavored coffee. I'd trade all the sun dried
> tomato bagels in the whole world for one hot St. Viateur sesame bagel.
>
> BTW, a bagel is not something that you slice in half in order to make a
> sandwich. A proper bagel has a great big hole in the middle and makes a
> lousy sandwich bread. You make a sandwich on a roll or on two slices of
> bread. Bernie, if you are planning to make sandwiches, I'd much rather that
> you bake bolillos for tortas - this fits in with your location and the
> "Slow Food" idea so much better than an anonymous globalized bagel sandwich
> that you could buy at McDonalds in Iowa or Helsinki.
>
>
>

Here is the situation so far. I have a 900 sq ft space a few
storefronts down from my store that is set up as a bakery. I'm moving in
several banks of ovens, four-burner and griddle. We will move our batch
freezer for making gelato and much of our prep reefers down there and do
an expanded but simple menu. Soups, salads, vegetable plates, panini,
breads, cinnamon rolls, muffins, scones, etc. I hear a lot of folks
wanting "real" bagels who have moved here from "the city" and are
willing to pay. I haven't run the numbers too hard, but it appears that
adding bagels would be profitable at first blush. As we have gained a
reputation for excellent quality over the years we have always wanted to
improve the quality of baked goods. It seems simple, but it isn't.
Serving a cup of Harrar, Yemen, PNG or Guatemala that has been roasted
the day before and is in full bloom is something we do. I think it would
be nice to serve a perfectly baked bagel or other baked good with that
coffee. We are in a town of 80,000 and although it is very poor compared
to the rest of the nation, we are seeing a substantial increase in the
monied crowd moving here for retirement. I think Las Cruces has been on
the top of most "Best Place" to retire lists for several years. I just
think that offering the only real boiled bagel along with excellent
coffee and other baked goods would attract and keep good customers. It
won't be long before another roastery opens I'm sure. And I'd like to be
always a step ahead, especially with as small a customer pool for higher
tickets as there is here. As for the sandwich being made from a bagel,
never in my shop. We do have an auxilliary steamer and we toast a bagel
and cover it with eggs and green chili that have been steamed and
fluffed with the steamer wand. Drop on a couple of slices of Boar's Head
cheese and it is a pretty decent plate.
Bernie


     
Date: 16 Jun 2007 10:54:41
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:aqydnb67_ILLj-nbnZ2dnUVZ_o6gnZ2d@comcast.com...
> The two are mutually exclusive - there are three proper bagels varieties-
> plain, sesame, poppy. The rest are all abominations -

ok, they sold the three proper varieties, plus some abominations. However
now they sell nothing as the business is defunct.




  
Date: 16 Jun 2007 09:41:15
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
If you don't boil it's not a bagel, it's just a roll with a hole in the
middle. Kettling is essential to making a real bagel.


"Dan Bollinger" <danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com > wrote in message
news:xbqdnX9uQoSGeO7bnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@insightbb.com...
> Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw it
> on 'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.
>
>
> "bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com> wrote in message
> news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
>> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
>> Bernie
>




   
Date: 16 Jun 2007 11:36:46
From: Ed Needham
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
I believe it is actually an alkaline dip in boiling water to give a bagel
the type of crust it has.
--
*********************
Ed Needham
"to absurdity and beyond!"
http://www.homeroaster.com
(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************

"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:0JqdndxkfZ3mde7bnZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> If you don't boil it's not a bagel, it's just a roll with a hole in the
> middle. Kettling is essential to making a real bagel.




    
Date: 16 Jun 2007 12:20:29
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Alkaline dip is a soft pretzel. Bagels get dipped in plain water, sometimes
flavored with honey or malt syrup.


"Ed Needham" <ed@NOSPAMhomeroaster.com > wrote in message
news:0OydnevKF9QenunbnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@insightbb.com...
>I believe it is actually an alkaline dip in boiling water to give a bagel
>the type of crust it has.
> --
> *********************
> Ed Needham
> "to absurdity and beyond!"
> http://www.homeroaster.com
> (include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
> *********************
>
> "Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:0JqdndxkfZ3mde7bnZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> If you don't boil it's not a bagel, it's just a roll with a hole in the
>> middle. Kettling is essential to making a real bagel.
>
>




     
Date: 16 Jun 2007 13:48:30
From: Ed Needham
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
I will not dispute 'Jack Denver' on how a bagel is made. ::grin::
--
*********************
Ed Needham®
"to absurdity and beyond!"
http://www.homeroaster.com
(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************

"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:-qidnSmRVONQkOnbnZ2dnUVZ_qOpnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Alkaline dip is a soft pretzel. Bagels get dipped in plain water,
> sometimes flavored with honey or malt syrup.
>
>
> "Ed Needham" <ed@NOSPAMhomeroaster.com> wrote in message
> news:0OydnevKF9QenunbnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@insightbb.com...
>>I believe it is actually an alkaline dip in boiling water to give a bagel
>>the type of crust it has.




     
Date: 16 Jun 2007 10:56:30
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:-qidnSmRVONQkOnbnZ2dnUVZ_qOpnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Alkaline dip is a soft pretzel. Bagels get dipped in plain water,
> sometimes flavored with honey or malt syrup.
>

so what do you get if you boil soft pretzel's in water with honey or malt
syrup? A Pragel?




   
Date: 16 Jun 2007 14:36:23
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
The now defunct famous Jewish bakery (damned old age - I can't recall the
name!) in Bellevue, WA used to have a huge steam chamber for their bagels -
no boiling. They were wonderful - chewy & delicious.
--
Robert Harmon
--
My coffee pages. - http://www.tinyurl.com/mb4uj

My 'Guidelines For Newbies' - http://www.tinyurl.com/2tnv87

Gaggia Classic; a great machine! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2enxjo

Nuova Simonelli Mac & grinder price cut! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2aogu2

"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:0JqdndxkfZ3mde7bnZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> If you don't boil it's not a bagel, it's just a roll with a hole in the
> middle. Kettling is essential to making a real bagel.
>
>
> "Dan Bollinger" <danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com> wrote in message
> news:xbqdnX9uQoSGeO7bnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@insightbb.com...
>> Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw it
>> on 'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.
>>
>>
>> "bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com> wrote in message
>> news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>>> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels. No
>>> clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the stove?
>>> Bernie
>>
>
>




    
Date: 16 Jun 2007 11:11:26
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Yes, we all know how famous Bellevue, WA is for its bagels.

I suppose steam could come close to water in it's effect on the surface of
the dough - the water causes the starch to gelatinize and give the bagel its
shiny coat. But, a real NY bagel is boiled, period. If you're steaming you
can't sweeten the water with honey or malt, which is another important step.

Personally I think NY style bagels, especially really bad doughy ones, have
become way too common - you can get them everywhere now - even in NM. I'd
rather see something a little different - Montreal style bagels done in a
wood fired oven, bialies, Mexican Bolillos, onion boards, anything but
another dull me too bagel.




"Robert Harmon" <r_h_harmon@Zhotmail.com > wrote in message
news:HzSci.989$W_6.476@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> The now defunct famous Jewish bakery (damned old age - I can't recall the
> name!) in Bellevue, WA used to have a huge steam chamber for their
> bagels - no boiling. They were wonderful - chewy & delicious.
> --
> Robert Harmon
> --
> My coffee pages. - http://www.tinyurl.com/mb4uj
>
> My 'Guidelines For Newbies' - http://www.tinyurl.com/2tnv87
>
> Gaggia Classic; a great machine! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2enxjo
>
> Nuova Simonelli Mac & grinder price cut! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2aogu2
>
> "Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:0JqdndxkfZ3mde7bnZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> If you don't boil it's not a bagel, it's just a roll with a hole in the
>> middle. Kettling is essential to making a real bagel.
>>
>>
>> "Dan Bollinger" <danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com> wrote in message
>> news:xbqdnX9uQoSGeO7bnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@insightbb.com...
>>> Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw
>>> it on 'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.
>>>
>>>
>>> "bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com> wrote in message
>>> news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>>>> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels.
>>>> No clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the
>>>> stove?
>>>> Bernie
>>>
>>
>>
>
>




     
Date: 17 Jun 2007 09:50:12
From: Coffee for Connoisseurs
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
Have to say that the absolutely best beigel (pronounced by-gul, in a strong
London accent) I've ever had was from Brick Lane, see
http://www.london-eating.co.uk/2687.htm . Boiled in alkali, as I understand
it, and absolutely superb. AFAIK if it ain't boiled before baking, it ain't
a Bagel, it's a baked doughnut.


--
Alan

alanfrew@coffeeco.com.au
www.coffeeco.com.au





      
Date: 17 Jun 2007 07:24:36
From: Dan Bollinger
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
> Boiled in alkali, as I understand it, and absolutely superb. AFAIK if it ain't
> boiled before baking, it ain't a Bagel, it's a baked doughnut.

Correction, it would be a baked bagel. Traditionally, doughnuts are cooked in
oil, not baked. Some commercial bakeries bake doughnuts. The reason doughnuts
have holes is so you can fish them out of the hot oil with a stick. Besides, the
dough recipe is different for doughnuts and bagels.

Dan



     
Date: 16 Jun 2007 16:01:22
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Bagel Boiling Question
See, you don't get it, do you. Anything in Bellevue, Kirkland, Woodinville,
& Redmond, is *famous*, if for no other reason than they're made in those
towns, i.e., Microsoft & Redhook Brewery. Seattle proper is so passé,
Sheeeessh!
--
Robert Harmon
--
My coffee pages. - http://www.tinyurl.com/mb4uj

My 'Guidelines For Newbies' - http://www.tinyurl.com/2tnv87

Gaggia Classic; a great machine! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2enxjo

Nuova Simonelli Mac & grinder price cut! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2aogu2
"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:F-6dnXY-xOcDYO7bnZ2dnUVZ_r6vnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Yes, we all know how famous Bellevue, WA is for its bagels.
>
> I suppose steam could come close to water in it's effect on the surface of
> the dough - the water causes the starch to gelatinize and give the bagel
> its shiny coat. But, a real NY bagel is boiled, period. If you're steaming
> you can't sweeten the water with honey or malt, which is another important
> step.
>
> Personally I think NY style bagels, especially really bad doughy ones,
> have become way too common - you can get them everywhere now - even in NM.
> I'd rather see something a little different - Montreal style bagels done
> in a wood fired oven, bialies, Mexican Bolillos, onion boards, anything
> but another dull me too bagel.
>
>
>
>
> "Robert Harmon" <r_h_harmon@Zhotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:HzSci.989$W_6.476@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>> The now defunct famous Jewish bakery (damned old age - I can't recall the
>> name!) in Bellevue, WA used to have a huge steam chamber for their
>> bagels - no boiling. They were wonderful - chewy & delicious.
>> --
>> Robert Harmon
>> --
>> My coffee pages. - http://www.tinyurl.com/mb4uj
>>
>> My 'Guidelines For Newbies' - http://www.tinyurl.com/2tnv87
>>
>> Gaggia Classic; a great machine! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2enxjo
>>
>> Nuova Simonelli Mac & grinder price cut! - http://www.tinyurl.com/2aogu2
>>
>> "Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net> wrote in message
>> news:0JqdndxkfZ3mde7bnZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>>> If you don't boil it's not a bagel, it's just a roll with a hole in the
>>> middle. Kettling is essential to making a real bagel.
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dan Bollinger" <danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com> wrote in message
>>> news:xbqdnX9uQoSGeO7bnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@insightbb.com...
>>>> Commercial bakeries don't boil, they just bake in continous ovens. Saw
>>>> it on 'How it's made". I know it is traditional to boil.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "bernie" <bdigman@zianet.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:4673dd2a@nntp.zianet.com...
>>>>> I'm looking for info on the best commercial equipment to boil bagels.
>>>>> No clue from this desert rat. A tilt skillet? Just a big pot on the
>>>>> stove?
>>>>> Bernie
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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