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Date: 12 Oct 2006 07:23:17
From: Brewer Bob
Subject: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Hello All,

I've been roasting now going on 3.5 years and have had many people
request roasted coffee from me which, I have no problem doing. I've
always gave them a fair price per pound. When I started selling to
other people, I was pretty generous and the pound would up to be close
to 18 ounces. Now, I have rethought all of this being I buy green by
the pound and after I roast it, it is ~ 14 ounces. My question is
this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them the green
price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.

Brewer Bob




 
Date: 15 Oct 2006 07:42:21
From: Flasherly
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Brewer Bob wrote:

> No, I am not trolling. I am just roasting
> for a few guys in the office I work in and I'm not a commercial
> enterprise. I guess I should've asked that when I have a pound of green
> from Sweet ias and after I roast it and they want to compensate me
> for my costs and time should I say I roasted a pound for them....jeez
> ...they want to toss me 15 bucks but, I tell them only ten. I'm amused
> that I kicked up such a firestorm of ethics, politics and religion. ;) I
> appreciate all of your input. Thanks.

What appears economically obvious, at 12oz., may already be given Look
on the superket shelves - isn't that the evident inference
convention holds - that a lb. of green is reducible by water loss to
12oz.? I doubt enjoyment derived from production can realistically
continue, but as a practicality eases into something else - in all
fairness, an externality pattern within business realms - if scope of
worth is to come and collect a broader sense of recognition success
garners. Your generous benefactors, today, needn't continue to be the
same people with excessive donnations tomorrow. In order to
accommodate all types, lucratively, to level them, rapid and apparent
equity need be transposed into immediate respect. Something must be
offered, an advantageous entity proffered, within such immediate
conditions a sell sustains through respectful dialogue with the buyer.
A business musn't undersell or inconsiderately distinguish itself apart
from what is respectful. What is offered is simply conducive in
furthering dealings with others, both as an acceptably important and
respectful identity of a nature of concerned manners regard.
Established conventions are requisite. Informed decisions encompass to
engage in the directly participatory by direct tactfulness. The
subsequent stake is to be considered a bet, a wager, based upon some
conviction to intend apply beneficially clear ethical and financial
meaning through a valid universe of participatory parties.



  
Date: 15 Oct 2006 12:45:33
From: Ed Needham
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
12 ounce bags work great for me. I roast five pounds of green, and bag five
12 oz. bags of roasted with around 5-7 ounces for me to use and sample to
make sure the roast was good.
I can sell a 12oz. bag for under $10, which seems like a better break point
than asking for $10+. If I get a good deal on a bag of green, I pass the
cost savings on.
--
*********************
Ed Needham®
"to absurdity and beyond!"
http://www.homeroaster.com
(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************

"Flasherly" <gjerrell@ij.net > wrote in message
news:1160923341.633611.75330@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> What appears economically obvious, at 12oz., may already be given Look
> on the superket shelves - isn't that the evident inference
> convention holds - that a lb. of green is reducible by water loss to
> 12oz.?
<SNIP >




 
Date: 14 Oct 2006 15:05:42
From: Brewer Bob
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

Barry Jarrett wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Oct 2006 07:23:17 GMT, Brewer Bob
> <bob-girolamo@nospam.sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> >My question is
> >this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them the green
> >price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
> >Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.
>
> what is "fair" and even what is legal depends, in part, on how you
> present the pricing to your "customers". if you say the coffee is "$8
> per pound" and you collect $8 and only deliver 14 oz, then that isn't
> good, nor legal. if you say the coffee is "$8 per pound" and deliver
> 14oz, but only collect $7, then that is fine. of course, the easiest
> and least confusing way is to price by the pound and deliver a full
> pound.
>
> --barry "now you need a certified scale" ;)

I have a high end digital lab scale

Brewer Bob



  
Date: 14 Oct 2006 17:15:42
From: North Sullivan
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
On 14 Oct 2006 15:05:42 -0700, "Brewer Bob"
<bob-girolamo@sbcglobal.net > wrote:

>
>Barry Jarrett wrote:

>> --barry "now you need a certified scale" ;)
>
>I have a high end digital lab scale
>
>Brewer Bob

Many states require a certified scale (certified by the state or a
private scale agency authorized to do the certifying), if you weigh
and sell stuff. Doesn't matter how accurate your scale, unless it's
got the little sticker/certification/fee paid.

North Sullivan



 
Date: 13 Oct 2006 05:57:45
From: Barry Jarrett
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
On Thu, 12 Oct 2006 07:23:17 GMT, Brewer Bob
<bob-girolamo@nospam.sbcglobal.net > wrote:

>My question is
>this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them the green
>price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
>Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.

what is "fair" and even what is legal depends, in part, on how you
present the pricing to your "customers". if you say the coffee is "$8
per pound" and you collect $8 and only deliver 14 oz, then that isn't
good, nor legal. if you say the coffee is "$8 per pound" and deliver
14oz, but only collect $7, then that is fine. of course, the easiest
and least confusing way is to price by the pound and deliver a full
pound.

--barry "now you need a certified scale" ;)


 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 22:25:42
From: rasqual
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Jack Denver wrote:
> I'm not expert on theology, but as far as I can tell, the Catholic Church
> (upon whom I would depend for economic advice about as much as I'd depend on
> Alan Greenspan to give me theological insight) has never completely bought
> into capitalism and continues to talk about "fairness" in economic matters.
> There's a big distinction (in my mind at least) between those kinds of
> "fairness" that depend on moral appeals to conscience and are thus voluntary
> (or your punishment is in the next life) and those that are based upon
> legal compulsion, so that whether you buy into the moral argument or not,
> the government will fine or imprison you if you violate them. I'm ok with
> the first kind, but in modern times, the kind of people who believe in
> "fairness" have not been reticent about getting the government to back them
> up whenever they think it is politically possible - [...]

Good observations all.

Or certification systems. Good as far as they go, they're capable of
producing some unanticipated tyrranies (just as utopianisms, with their
delusory hopes of succeeding, will justify even horrendous means by
ends that remain ever out of reach). I have one lady who generally
wants Fair Trade beans only. She really should buy some of my beans
that aren't. Why? Because I purchase them from a vendor who's sinking a
lot of his own capital -- direct trade style -- into a Kenyan farm that
he's not even buying coffee from. He's supporting a small village,
basically, while helping them improve their crop till the day when
he'll be willing to buy their product. So if she would only buy beans
that he supplies me REGARDLESS of their certifications, good things
would come of it for people who desperately need help.

:-\

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of
in our certifications."

- S



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 22:03:09
From: rasqual
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

jim schulman wrote:
> The concept of a "fair price" rather than a ket one dates from
> around 1250 courtesy of Thomas Aquinas. It was a pretty dead concept
> by around 1450. But I'm pretty sure even Saint Thomas would have been
> scratching his head if asked whether $4.20 for 14 ounces was more or
> less fair than $4.80 for 16.

LOL

I'm frightfully Thomistic, so that laugh is sincere.

That's funny Jim.

Regards -



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 22:03:54
From: The Other Funk
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Finding the keyboard operational
Brewer Bob entered:

> Hello All,
>
> I've been roasting now going on 3.5 years and have had many people
> request roasted coffee from me which, I have no problem doing. I've
> always gave them a fair price per pound. When I started selling to
> other people, I was pretty generous and the pound would up to be close
> to 18 ounces. Now, I have rethought all of this being I buy green by
> the pound and after I roast it, it is ~ 14 ounces. My question is
> this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them the green
> price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.
>
> Brewer Bob
If they are paying for a pound of coffee they should get 16 ozs. The other
2 ozs. are part of the cost of doing business.
ON the other hand, you are doing this for your friends not for a business.
So if it makes you happy to get $X for Y ozs. then enjoy your friends.
Bob

--
--
Coffee worth staying up for - NY Times
www.moondoggiecoffee.com



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 13:56:41
From: Omniryx@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

jim schulman wrote:
> The concept of a "fair price" rather than a ket one dates from
> around 1250 courtesy of Thomas Aquinas. It was a pretty dead concept
> by around 1450.

Nay, nay, not so. Or at least only so in the minds of so-called "free
keters."

> Left and right date from 1791.

But fair and unfair date from 0000.

I'm done. This is off topic and just clogging up the bandwidth. I
graciously yield the last word to whichever of you wish to have it.

Will (Whose worst fears have been realized...at least on AC)



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 11:59:57
From: Shadd
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

>
> Wow! I wasn't expecting this. No, I am not trolling. I am just roasting
> for a few guys in the office I work in and I'm not a commercial
> enterprise. I guess I should've asked that when I have a pound of green
> from Sweet ias and after I roast it and they want to compensate me
> for my costs and time should I say I roasted a pound for them....jeez
> ...they want to toss me 15 bucks but, I tell them only ten. I'm amused
> that I kicked up such a firestorm of ethics, politics and religion. ;) I
> appreciate all of your input. Thanks.
>
> Brewer Bob
>

I would just come up with a price that offsets the inconvenience of the
extra roasting, but cheaper than they would pay retail...say $8-10 per
pound and call it good.

SAL



  
Date: 12 Oct 2006 19:04:35
From: Brewer Bob
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma


Shadd wrote:

>>Wow! I wasn't expecting this. No, I am not trolling. I am just roasting
>>for a few guys in the office I work in and I'm not a commercial
>>enterprise. I guess I should've asked that when I have a pound of green
>>from Sweet ias and after I roast it and they want to compensate me
>>for my costs and time should I say I roasted a pound for them....jeez
>>...they want to toss me 15 bucks but, I tell them only ten. I'm amused
>>that I kicked up such a firestorm of ethics, politics and religion. ;) I
>>appreciate all of your input. Thanks.
>>
>>Brewer Bob
>>
>>
>>
>
>I would just come up with a price that offsets the inconvenience of the
>extra roasting, but cheaper than they would pay retail...say $8-10 per
>pound and call it good.
>
>SAL
>
>
Thanks everyone for the info. I filled their orders with 1 full pound
of roasted beans for 10 bucks and they are greatful for having
"non-industrial" rotgut breakroom coffee. By no means I am one to rip
people off. There's another altie here that can attest to my generosity
over the years.

Cheers!
Brewer Bob
remove the nospam to contact me directly cuz I'm not a troll ;)


 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 10:08:56
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
The only way your question makes any sense is if you are directly passing
thru your per pound green cost only - if you buy green for $3/lb. and
charge only green cost then give your friends 14 oz. roasted for that same
$3. But if you are king up the coffee anyway (whether the kup is
"fair" or unfair) then don't confuse people by giving them short pounds -
just add the weight loss into your other kups for fuel, roaster
depreciation, whatever.


"Brewer Bob" <bob-girolamo@nospam.sbcglobal.net > wrote in message
news:F3mXg.21963$Ij.14481@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
> Hello All,
>
> I've been roasting now going on 3.5 years and have had many people request
> roasted coffee from me which, I have no problem doing. I've always gave
> them a fair price per pound. When I started selling to other people, I was
> pretty generous and the pound would up to be close to 18 ounces. Now, I
> have rethought all of this being I buy green by the pound and after I
> roast it, it is ~ 14 ounces. My question is this: If they pay me for a
> pound of coffee, do I charge them the green price before I roast or do I
> make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.
>
> Brewer Bob




 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 07:07:39
From: John S.
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

Brewer Bob wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> I've been roasting now going on 3.5 years and have had many people
> request roasted coffee from me which, I have no problem doing. I've
> always gave them a fair price per pound. When I started selling to
> other people, I was pretty generous and the pound would up to be close
> to 18 ounces. Now, I have rethought all of this being I buy green by
> the pound and after I roast it, it is ~ 14 ounces. My question is
> this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them the green
> price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.
>
> Brewer Bob

You would do as the seller of any other processed good would do.
Establish a retail price unit price for the fully processed good. For
coffee it is usually price per pound or price per 8 ounces.

You know what your costs are to produce and package a bag of roasted
beans. Just add whatever kup you think is appropriate. The per
pound price at established high quality roasters like Intelligentsia
could also serve as a guide.

You risk irritating all your customers and friends if you tell them
coffee is priced at $12.00 a pound green but only 14 ounces are
delivered.



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 06:57:23
From: Omniryx@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Gosh, I would hate to think that the day would come--or has
arrived--when simple fairness ceases to be a variable in the business
equation.

Will (an admitted leftist, to be sure)


jim schulman wrote:
> If you sell commercially, you charge whatever the ket
> will bear, and fairness doesn't enter into it. If you are doing it as
> a regular paid service to your friends, you charge all the costs --
> green coffee, roaster depreciation, energy, and your time, and
> fairness doesn't enter into it. If you're doing it as an occasional
> favor, you charge whatever is necessary to prevent your friends
> feeling like you're being embarassingly generous, and fairness doesn't
> enter it either.



  
Date: 13 Oct 2006 09:04:17
From: Brent
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
What the ket will bear is a fair ket price...

Personally I would (and do) sell by the roasted weight.

Brent

> Gosh, I would hate to think that the day would come--or has
> arrived--when simple fairness ceases to be a variable in the business
> equation.
>
> Will (an admitted leftist, to be sure)
>
>
> jim schulman wrote:
>> If you sell commercially, you charge whatever the ket
>> will bear, and fairness doesn't enter into it. If you are doing it as
>> a regular paid service to your friends, you charge all the costs --
>> green coffee, roaster depreciation, energy, and your time, and
>> fairness doesn't enter into it. If you're doing it as an occasional
>> favor, you charge whatever is necessary to prevent your friends
>> feeling like you're being embarassingly generous, and fairness doesn't
>> enter it either.
>




  
Date: 12 Oct 2006 09:47:51
From: jim schulman
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
On 12 Oct 2006 06:57:23 -0700, "Omniryx@gmail.com" <Omniryx@gmail.com >
wrote:

>Gosh, I would hate to think that the day would come--or has
>arrived--when simple fairness ceases to be a variable in the business
>equation.
>
>Will (an admitted leftist, to be sure)

The concept of a "fair price" rather than a ket one dates from
around 1250 courtesy of Thomas Aquinas. It was a pretty dead concept
by around 1450. But I'm pretty sure even Saint Thomas would have been
scratching his head if asked whether $4.20 for 14 ounces was more or
less fair than $4.80 for 16.

Left and right date from 1791.


   
Date: 12 Oct 2006 12:01:20
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
I'm not expert on theology, but as far as I can tell, the Catholic Church
(upon whom I would depend for economic advice about as much as I'd depend on
Alan Greenspan to give me theological insight) has never completely bought
into capitalism and continues to talk about "fairness" in economic matters.
There's a big distinction (in my mind at least) between those kinds of
"fairness" that depend on moral appeals to conscience and are thus voluntary
(or your punishment is in the next life) and those that are based upon
legal compulsion, so that whether you buy into the moral argument or not,
the government will fine or imprison you if you violate them. I'm ok with
the first kind, but in modern times, the kind of people who believe in
"fairness" have not been reticent about getting the government to back them
up whenever they think it is politically possible - this makes them worse
(in my book) than the traditional church types. Unlike Sharia, the church
has (at least until it came under the influence of or into competition with
xism) stayed mostly (if not completely) out of those things that
"belongeth to Caeser" and has not tried to convert church economics into
civil law. So for example, usury was a no-no for believers, but they had no
problem with non believers practicing it.

"Fair" is a loaded euphemism, like "pro-choice" or "affirmative action". At
bottom means substituting your judgment when you don't like the price that
the ket sets, which doesn't seem particularly "fair" at all, but if you
can influence language to the point where your word is accepted as the
correct term, you've already won most of the battle.

"Fair" prices can either be minimums or maximums. Minimum prices continue
to be politically popular in some fields such as minimum wage. In most
other areas they've lost popularity. "Fair trade" in the US used to mean a
form of resale price maintenance - in some states it was illegal for a
merchant to charge less than the MSRP for goods (an early anti-chain store
measure - all the stuff we are going thru with Walt is old ground that
was plowed 70 years ago when F.W. Woolworth and other early chains swept
aside the general store) , but in 1975 Congress outlawed all such
practices. "Fair trade" coffee is another such minimum price but does not
have the backing of law in most places.

Maximum prices seem to have lost favor for the most part. There are still
some limits on usury (the price of borrowing money) in some places and there
continues to be political pressure (though not much legislative success) on
limiting prices for other transactions that are seen as "predatory" upon the
poor - payday advance loans, rental furniture, etc. In some places, there
are "anti-gouging" laws that go in effect in case of emergencies, so people
can't charge $10/gallon for water or gas when the hurricane threatens. But
that's about it - if you want to pay $300/lb. for kopi luwak or rent a TV
set for total monthly payments that are 5 times the retail price or lose 10%
of your paycheck for the privilege of getting the money a week early, the
government lets you make your own decisions in most places.



"jim schulman" <jim_schulman@ameritech.net > wrote in message
news:g0lsi2dmgjf7mu43041c8tt4vqvuoum8sv@4ax.com...
> On 12 Oct 2006 06:57:23 -0700, "Omniryx@gmail.com" <Omniryx@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>Gosh, I would hate to think that the day would come--or has
>>arrived--when simple fairness ceases to be a variable in the business
>>equation.
>>
>>Will (an admitted leftist, to be sure)
>
> The concept of a "fair price" rather than a ket one dates from
> around 1250 courtesy of Thomas Aquinas. It was a pretty dead concept
> by around 1450. But I'm pretty sure even Saint Thomas would have been
> scratching his head if asked whether $4.20 for 14 ounces was more or
> less fair than $4.80 for 16.
>
> Left and right date from 1791.




    
Date: 12 Oct 2006 16:57:49
From: Brewer Bob
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma


Jack Denver wrote:

>I'm not expert on theology, but as far as I can tell, the Catholic Church
>(upon whom I would depend for economic advice about as much as I'd depend on
>Alan Greenspan to give me theological insight) has never completely bought
>into capitalism and continues to talk about "fairness" in economic matters.
>There's a big distinction (in my mind at least) between those kinds of
>"fairness" that depend on moral appeals to conscience and are thus voluntary
>(or your punishment is in the next life) and those that are based upon
>legal compulsion, so that whether you buy into the moral argument or not,
>the government will fine or imprison you if you violate them. I'm ok with
>the first kind, but in modern times, the kind of people who believe in
>"fairness" have not been reticent about getting the government to back them
>up whenever they think it is politically possible - this makes them worse
>(in my book) than the traditional church types. Unlike Sharia, the church
>has (at least until it came under the influence of or into competition with
>xism) stayed mostly (if not completely) out of those things that
>"belongeth to Caeser" and has not tried to convert church economics into
>civil law. So for example, usury was a no-no for believers, but they had no
>problem with non believers practicing it.
>
>"Fair" is a loaded euphemism, like "pro-choice" or "affirmative action". At
>bottom means substituting your judgment when you don't like the price that
>the ket sets, which doesn't seem particularly "fair" at all, but if you
>can influence language to the point where your word is accepted as the
>correct term, you've already won most of the battle.
>
>"Fair" prices can either be minimums or maximums. Minimum prices continue
>to be politically popular in some fields such as minimum wage. In most
>other areas they've lost popularity. "Fair trade" in the US used to mean a
>form of resale price maintenance - in some states it was illegal for a
>merchant to charge less than the MSRP for goods (an early anti-chain store
>measure - all the stuff we are going thru with Walt is old ground that
>was plowed 70 years ago when F.W. Woolworth and other early chains swept
>aside the general store) , but in 1975 Congress outlawed all such
>practices. "Fair trade" coffee is another such minimum price but does not
>have the backing of law in most places.
>
>Maximum prices seem to have lost favor for the most part. There are still
>some limits on usury (the price of borrowing money) in some places and there
>continues to be political pressure (though not much legislative success) on
>limiting prices for other transactions that are seen as "predatory" upon the
>poor - payday advance loans, rental furniture, etc. In some places, there
>are "anti-gouging" laws that go in effect in case of emergencies, so people
>can't charge $10/gallon for water or gas when the hurricane threatens. But
>that's about it - if you want to pay $300/lb. for kopi luwak or rent a TV
>set for total monthly payments that are 5 times the retail price or lose 10%
>of your paycheck for the privilege of getting the money a week early, the
>government lets you make your own decisions in most places.
>
>
>
>"jim schulman" <jim_schulman@ameritech.net> wrote in message
>news:g0lsi2dmgjf7mu43041c8tt4vqvuoum8sv@4ax.com...
>
>
>>On 12 Oct 2006 06:57:23 -0700, "Omniryx@gmail.com" <Omniryx@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Gosh, I would hate to think that the day would come--or has
>>>arrived--when simple fairness ceases to be a variable in the business
>>>equation.
>>>
>>>Will (an admitted leftist, to be sure)
>>>
>>>
>>The concept of a "fair price" rather than a ket one dates from
>>around 1250 courtesy of Thomas Aquinas. It was a pretty dead concept
>>by around 1450. But I'm pretty sure even Saint Thomas would have been
>>scratching his head if asked whether $4.20 for 14 ounces was more or
>>less fair than $4.80 for 16.
>>
>>Left and right date from 1791.
>>
>>

Wow! I wasn't expecting this. No, I am not trolling. I am just roasting
for a few guys in the office I work in and I'm not a commercial
enterprise. I guess I should've asked that when I have a pound of green
from Sweet ias and after I roast it and they want to compensate me
for my costs and time should I say I roasted a pound for them....jeez
...they want to toss me 15 bucks but, I tell them only ten. I'm amused
that I kicked up such a firestorm of ethics, politics and religion. ;) I
appreciate all of your input. Thanks.

Brewer Bob

>
>
>
>


     
Date: 12 Oct 2006 23:23:17
From: Ed Needham
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
I use a 12 ounce bag and tell them they are buying a 12 ounce bag. It's
also ked that way on the label. I price it so that I can make a little
profit above my costs.
--
*********************
Ed Needham®
"to absurdity and beyond!"
http://www.homeroaster.com
(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************


"Brewer Bob" <bob-girolamo@nospam.sbcglobal.net > wrote in message
news:huuXg.14394$6S3.165@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
> Wow! I wasn't expecting this. No, I am not trolling. I am just roasting
> for a few guys in the office I work in and I'm not a commercial
> enterprise. I guess I should've asked that when I have a pound of green
> from Sweet ias and after I roast it and they want to compensate me for
> my costs and time should I say I roasted a pound for them....jeez ...they
> want to toss me 15 bucks but, I tell them only ten. I'm amused that I
> kicked up such a firestorm of ethics, politics and religion. ;) I
> appreciate all of your input. Thanks.
>
> Brewer Bob
>
>>
>>
>>




      
Date: 13 Oct 2006 17:27:06
From: Brent
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
ah, come on Ed, if your coffee is good, then make good gin :) otherwise
how do you plan to get / make better toys to make your coffee better!

Brent

>I use a 12 ounce bag and tell them they are buying a 12 ounce bag. It's
>also ked that way on the label. I price it so that I can make a little
>profit above my costs.
> --
> *********************
> Ed Needham®
> "to absurdity and beyond!"
> http://www.homeroaster.com
> (include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
> *********************




       
Date: 13 Oct 2006 01:08:18
From: Ed Needham
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
I get just enough to help pay for my
hobby/lifestyle/passion/obsession/whatever.
--
*********************
Ed Needham®
"to absurdity and beyond!"
http://www.homeroaster.com
(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************

"Brent" <me@privacy.net > wrote in message
news:4p8ht4Fho9sjU1@individual.net...
> ah, come on Ed, if your coffee is good, then make good gin :) otherwise
> how do you plan to get / make better toys to make your coffee better!
>
> Brent




 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 06:36:52
From: daveb
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
16 ounces of finished product = 1 lb.

dave



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 07:47:41
From: Dan Bollinger
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
> My question is this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them
> the green price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the
> bag?
> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.

When you buy a gallon of gasoline, is it short a few ounces for the losses
involved in refining and delivery?



  
Date: 12 Oct 2006 11:41:53
From: Craig Andrews
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

"Dan Bollinger" <danNObollinger@insightSPAMbb.com > wrote in message
news:x8ydndgASYLAtrPYnZ2dnUVZ_t-dnZ2d@insightbb.com...
>> My question is this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I
>> charge them the green price before I roast or do I make sure that 16
>> ounces goes in the bag?
>> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.
>
> When you buy a gallon of gasoline, is it short a few ounces for the
> losses involved in refining and delivery?

No, but at the pumps they're adjusted/calibrated for temperature. Going
by memory here, but the pumps here in Toronto, Ontario, Canada are
calibrated to 60°F. Pump when it's hotter in the summer you'll get less
gasoline, colder & you'll get more supposedly.
Craig.



   
Date: 13 Oct 2006 20:20:39
From: Roger Shoaf
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

"Craig Andrews" <alt.coffee@deletethis.rogers.com > wrote in message
news:4p7622Fhe96rU1@individual.net...

>
> No, but at the pumps they're adjusted/calibrated for temperature. Going
> by memory here, but the pumps here in Toronto, Ontario, Canada are
> calibrated to 60°F. Pump when it's hotter in the summer you'll get less
> gasoline, colder & you'll get more supposedly.
> Craig.
>

Actually the temperature calibrated pumps were installed to give you the
energy equivalent of a gallon of gasoline at 60F. Quite often in the States
this is not the case and the retailer is selling you one gallon of what ever
the fuel temp is.

Currently there is a big stink about this brewing.
see:
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/business/personal_finance/15370193.htm




    
Date: 14 Oct 2006 11:36:38
From: Craig Andrews
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma

"Roger Shoaf" <shoaf@nospamsyix.com > wrote in message
news:1160796028.137216@news01.syix.com...
>
> "Craig Andrews" <alt.coffee@deletethis.rogers.com> wrote in message
> news:4p7622Fhe96rU1@individual.net...
>
>>
>> No, but at the pumps they're adjusted/calibrated for temperature.
>> Going
>> by memory here, but the pumps here in Toronto, Ontario, Canada are
>> calibrated to 60°F. Pump when it's hotter in the summer you'll get
>> less
>> gasoline, colder & you'll get more supposedly.
>> Craig.
>>
>
> Actually the temperature calibrated pumps were installed to give you
> the
> energy equivalent of a gallon of gasoline at 60F. Quite often in the
> States
> this is not the case and the retailer is selling you one gallon of
> what ever
> the fuel temp is.
>
> Currently there is a big stink about this brewing.
> see:
> http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/business/personal_finance/15370193.htm
>
>

Thanks for the story Roger! {;-)
Cheers!
Craig.



 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 07:00:34
From: St. John Smythe
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Brewer Bob wrote:
> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.

If they were buying green beans from you and paying you to roast them,
then you'd charge by the green pound. But if you're selling roasted
beans, they should be sold by the roasted pound.

--
St. John
Watch your mouth, kid, or you'll find yourself floating home.
-Han Solo


 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 05:47:59
From: jim schulman
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
On Thu, 12 Oct 2006 07:23:17 GMT, Brewer Bob
<bob-girolamo@nospam.sbcglobal.net > wrote:

>I've been roasting now going on 3.5 years and have had many people
>request roasted coffee from me ....
>I always gave them a fair price per pound. ... do I charge them the green
>price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?

The fairness of your price seems like matter only between you and your
conscience. If you sell commercially, you charge whatever the ket
will bear, and fairness doesn't enter into it. If you are doing it as
a regular paid service to your friends, you charge all the costs --
green coffee, roaster depreciation, energy, and your time, and
fairness doesn't enter into it. If you're doing it as an occasional
favor, you charge whatever is necessary to prevent your friends
feeling like you're being embarassingly generous, and fairness doesn't
enter it either.


 
Date: 12 Oct 2006 01:32:33
From: abimer
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Surely you are trolling.

People have every right to get the weight of product that you state you
are selling. Few customers would know that coffee loses weight as it
roasts, but far, far fewer would actually care.

Obviously, as a coffee roaster, you should be well aware of the water
content during roasting. That should be factored into your pricing
fairly - i.e. if you lose 15% weight, charge 15% more than you do now.
Don't give 15% less.

You can't charge people for lost water they don't want.



Brewer Bob wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> I've been roasting now going on 3.5 years and have had many people
> request roasted coffee from me which, I have no problem doing. I've
> always gave them a fair price per pound. When I started selling to
> other people, I was pretty generous and the pound would up to be close
> to 18 ounces. Now, I have rethought all of this being I buy green by
> the pound and after I roast it, it is ~ 14 ounces. My question is
> this: If they pay me for a pound of coffee, do I charge them the green
> price before I roast or do I make sure that 16 ounces goes in the bag?
> Any guidance in this matter will be appreciated.
>
> Brewer Bob



  
Date: 13 Nov 2006 18:00:37
From: Lavarock
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
abimer wrote:
> Surely you are trolling.
>
> People have every right to get the weight of product that you state you
> are selling. Few customers would know that coffee loses weight as it
> roasts, but far, far fewer would actually care.
>
> Obviously, as a coffee roaster, you should be well aware of the water
> content during roasting. That should be factored into your pricing
> fairly - i.e. if you lose 15% weight, charge 15% more than you do now.
> Don't give 15% less.
>
> You can't charge people for lost water they don't want.
>
>
This works for all things except 2 by 4's which hopefully people realize
are not 2" nor 4". 2 by 4's are sold with the pre-milling size.


   
Date: 14 Nov 2006 21:50:30
From: The Other Funk
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
Finding the keyboard operational
Lavarock entered:

> abimer wrote:
>> Surely you are trolling.
>>
>> People have every right to get the weight of product that you state
>> you are selling. Few customers would know that coffee loses weight
>> as it roasts, but far, far fewer would actually care.
>>
>> Obviously, as a coffee roaster, you should be well aware of the water
>> content during roasting. That should be factored into your pricing
>> fairly - i.e. if you lose 15% weight, charge 15% more than you do
>> now. Don't give 15% less.
>>
>> You can't charge people for lost water they don't want.
>>
>>
> This works for all things except 2 by 4's which hopefully people
> realize are not 2" nor 4". 2 by 4's are sold with the pre-milling
> size.

Dimensional lumber is sold by lenght not by weight and so is a poor example.
Unprepared food seems to be sold by weight. Unlike a 14 oz resturant steak
which is a precooked weight.
If you wish to package your coffee by the pound, 14 oz or even 12 oz go
right ahead. Just don't call it a pound if it's 12 oz.
Bob

--
--
Coffee worth staying up for - NY Times
www.moondoggiecoffee.com



   
Date: 13 Nov 2006 18:32:52
From: Ian Smith
Subject: Re: Coffee Sales Dilemma
On Mon, 13 Nov, Lavarock <lavarock1@myhawaiiansite.com > wrote:
> abimer wrote:
> > Surely you are trolling.
> >
> > You can't charge people for lost water they don't want.
> >
> This works for all things except 2 by 4's which hopefully people realize
> are not 2" nor 4". 2 by 4's are sold with the pre-milling size.

Steaks are often sized by uncooked weight. I believe burgers are also
(eg 'quarter pounder'), but I have too little experience/knowledge on
that topic to confirm.

However, an as-sawn 2x4 is 2"x4", it's only if it's PAR that it's
smaller than nominal dimensions. (Or theoretically, if it's
part-planed, but I've never seen a timber merchant offer that - it's
either sawn, or PAR).

regards, Ian SMith
--