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Date: 15 Dec 2006 11:14:39
From: shane
Subject: I just want a good cup of coffee!
I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks actually
has better coffee.

Why do so few people know what good coffee is?

With the seemingly huge explosion in the "specialty" coffee industry in
the past few years, it amazes me about how many people still just don't
get it. The vast majority of the world seems to be quite blissfully
happy with a state of mediocratey. Making good coffee is just like
making fast-food to them, I guess.

I actually think that Starbucks gets what good coffee is, but they just
cannot deliver on the scale they are at now. Anyone remember what
they were like before they exploded? I was too young and in the wrong
part of the country at the time to know. To Starbuck's credit, they
are consistent, no matter which one you go to the coffee is the same.
They are pleasant to go into, the staff is always clean and well
mannered.

98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.

Shane





 
Date: 18 Dec 2006 06:48:16
From: shane
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
I hope that you realize the meaning of what I said. In the context of
the area I live in, Starbucks has better coffee. For the most past
with perhaps one or two exceptions all of the independants only strive
to be as good as Starbucks.


TRTRTR wrote:
> ...you lost me at " Starbucks has better coffee " ;o)
>
>
> On 15 Dec 2006 11:14:39 -0800, "shane" <shane.olson@juno.com> wrote:
>
> >I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
> >tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
> >walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
> >going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks actually
> >has better coffee.
> >
> >Why do so few people know what good coffee is?
> >
> >With the seemingly huge explosion in the "specialty" coffee industry in
> >the past few years, it amazes me about how many people still just don't
> >get it. The vast majority of the world seems to be quite blissfully
> >happy with a state of mediocratey. Making good coffee is just like
> >making fast-food to them, I guess.
> >
> >I actually think that Starbucks gets what good coffee is, but they just
> >cannot deliver on the scale they are at now. Anyone remember what
> >they were like before they exploded? I was too young and in the wrong
> >part of the country at the time to know. To Starbuck's credit, they
> >are consistent, no matter which one you go to the coffee is the same.
> >They are pleasant to go into, the staff is always clean and well
> >mannered.
> >
> >98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
> >to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
> >it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
> >perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.
> >
> >Shane



  
Date: 18 Dec 2006 15:06:01
From: TRTRTR
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!

...yep :O) was said tongue-in-cheek


On 18 Dec 2006 06:48:16 -0800, "shane" <shane.olson@juno.com > wrote:

>I hope that you realize the meaning of what I said. In the context of
>the area I live in, Starbucks has better coffee. For the most past
>with perhaps one or two exceptions all of the independants only strive
>to be as good as Starbucks.
>
>
>TRTRTR wrote:
>> ...you lost me at " Starbucks has better coffee " ;o)
>>
>>
>> On 15 Dec 2006 11:14:39 -0800, "shane" <shane.olson@juno.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
>> >tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
>> >walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
>> >going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks actually
>> >has better coffee.
>> >
>> >Why do so few people know what good coffee is?
>> >
>> >With the seemingly huge explosion in the "specialty" coffee industry in
>> >the past few years, it amazes me about how many people still just don't
>> >get it. The vast majority of the world seems to be quite blissfully
>> >happy with a state of mediocratey. Making good coffee is just like
>> >making fast-food to them, I guess.
>> >
>> >I actually think that Starbucks gets what good coffee is, but they just
>> >cannot deliver on the scale they are at now. Anyone remember what
>> >they were like before they exploded? I was too young and in the wrong
>> >part of the country at the time to know. To Starbuck's credit, they
>> >are consistent, no matter which one you go to the coffee is the same.
>> >They are pleasant to go into, the staff is always clean and well
>> >mannered.
>> >
>> >98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
>> >to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
>> >it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
>> >perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.
>> >
>> >Shane


 
Date: 17 Dec 2006 19:57:49
From: Roland
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!

. Anyone remember what
> they were like before they exploded? I was too young and in the wrong
> part of the country at the time to know. >

I was right here 25 years ago and in attendence at the right places to
experience early Starbucks. Wow! it was unlike anything I had ever
experienced in a cup. Was it better than it is today? Who knows, but it
was in a league of its own back then. Doubtless there was better coffee to
be had at that time in Italy, but not here in Seattle. Today thare are a
number of coffee shops here that make bettter coffee than Starbucks, but I
suspect that they only exist because Starbucks created the ket for them.




 
Date: 17 Dec 2006 06:41:29
From: TRTRTR
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!

...you lost me at " Starbucks has better coffee " ;o)


On 15 Dec 2006 11:14:39 -0800, "shane" <shane.olson@juno.com > wrote:

>I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
>tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
>walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
>going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks actually
>has better coffee.
>
>Why do so few people know what good coffee is?
>
>With the seemingly huge explosion in the "specialty" coffee industry in
>the past few years, it amazes me about how many people still just don't
>get it. The vast majority of the world seems to be quite blissfully
>happy with a state of mediocratey. Making good coffee is just like
>making fast-food to them, I guess.
>
>I actually think that Starbucks gets what good coffee is, but they just
>cannot deliver on the scale they are at now. Anyone remember what
>they were like before they exploded? I was too young and in the wrong
>part of the country at the time to know. To Starbuck's credit, they
>are consistent, no matter which one you go to the coffee is the same.
>They are pleasant to go into, the staff is always clean and well
>mannered.
>
>98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
>to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
>it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
>perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.
>
>Shane


 
Date: 16 Dec 2006 21:32:23
From: shane
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
I already have a Virtuoso and a pourover drip brewer at the office.
Every now and then I would like to go out for a latte. I can make good
espresso at home.

Shane


LF wrote:
> On Dec 15, 2:14 pm, "shane" <shane.ol...@juno.com> wrote:
> > I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
> > tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
> > walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
> > going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake <snip>...
>
> Getting a "good cupa" is as easy as 1-2-3.
>
> 1. <http://www.sweetias.com/aeropress_instructions.html>
> 2. <http://www.sweetias.com/prod.electricmills.shtml>
> 3. <http://www.espressovivace.com/blends.html>
>
> If that don't woik, after the holidays a *$ Barista should come down in
> price, and you can get one for the office. It will be a savings over
> the c$500 bucks/ year it takes to go out for a daily take-out brew.
>
> All the best,
> Larry



 
Date: 16 Dec 2006 13:35:56
From: daveb
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!

shane wrote:
> I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
> tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
> walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
> going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks actually
> has better coffee.
>
> Why do so few people know what good coffee is?
>
>
A great many independents don't know and / or don't care !!

and then whine that starbicks put them under. pathetic.

Dave
189



  
Date: 17 Dec 2006 23:49:06
From: The Other Funk
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
Finding the keyboard operational
daveb entered:

> shane wrote:
>> I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
>> tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte.
>> I walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead
>> of going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks
>> actually has better coffee.
>>
>> Why do so few people know what good coffee is?
>>
>>
> A great many independents don't know and / or don't care !!
>
> and then whine that starbicks put them under. pathetic.
>
> Dave
> 189

I don't believe that Starbucks has put anyone out of business. I think that
the case is that someone wasn't ready with a plan when a Starbucks opened
nearby. If you can't put out a good cup of coffee at a lower price and
provide a nice place to sell it, maybe a dfferent business is needed.
Bob

--
--
Coffee worth staying up for - NY Times
www.moondoggiecoffee.com



 
Date: 16 Dec 2006 05:51:39
From: LF
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!


On Dec 15, 2:14 pm, "shane" <shane.ol...@juno.com > wrote:
> I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
> tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
> walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
> going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake <snip>...

Getting a "good cupa" is as easy as 1-2-3.

1. <http://www.sweetias.com/aeropress_instructions.html >
2. <http://www.sweetias.com/prod.electricmills.shtml >
3. <http://www.espressovivace.com/blends.html >

If that don't woik, after the holidays a *$ Barista should come down in
price, and you can get one for the office. It will be a savings over
the c$500 bucks/ year it takes to go out for a daily take-out brew.

All the best,
Larry



 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 21:35:00
From: shane
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!

Harry Moos wrote:
> Have you considered that maybe you [and I] don't know what good coffe is and
> the other 90% are right? I make good coffee, and over half of our guests
> like it [in fact, rave about it]. But we do have several rather vocal
> guests who won't touch it because it doesn't taste like Folgers [the epitome
> of coffee to them]. In such a world, coffee shops will serve what sells.
>

Yeah, I don't think the other 90% have a clue. I have observerd that
many people in my area actually like "flavored" coffee. Oh well. More
good coffee for the rest of us :)

Shane



 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 21:31:01
From: shane
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!

Barry Jarrett wrote:
> On 15 Dec 2006 11:14:39 -0800, "shane" <shane.olson@juno.com> wrote:
>
> >cannot deliver on the scale they are at now. Anyone remember what
> >they were like before they exploded?
>
> yes. they did not serve espresso drinks at all.
>
>
> Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> ** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.usenet.com

Well, yes I do know that they started as roaster and bean retailer. I
was thinking the very early days of the Howard Schutlz takeover. Before
the expanded beyond Washington state and Oregon.

Shane



 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 18:50:14
From: Barry Jarrett
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
On 15 Dec 2006 11:14:39 -0800, "shane" <shane.olson@juno.com > wrote:

>cannot deliver on the scale they are at now. Anyone remember what
>they were like before they exploded?

yes. they did not serve espresso drinks at all.


Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com


  
Date: 16 Dec 2006 06:23:24
From: I->Ian
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:50:14 -0600, Barry Jarrett
<barry@rileys-coffee.com > wrote:

> they did not serve espresso drinks at all.

Still don't

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com



 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 17:52:13
From: Harry Moos
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
Have you considered that maybe you [and I] don't know what good coffe is and
the other 90% are right? I make good coffee, and over half of our guests
like it [in fact, rave about it]. But we do have several rather vocal
guests who won't touch it because it doesn't taste like Folgers [the epitome
of coffee to them]. In such a world, coffee shops will serve what sells.

"shane" <shane.olson@juno.com > wrote in message
news:1166210079.805653.55950@16g2000cwy.googlegroups.com...
>I am sitting in front of my computer drinking a weak barely coffee
> tasting conconction that some well meaning person thinks is a latte. I
> walked a few block down from work to a local coffee house instead of
> going to the Starbucks across the street. Mistake, Starbucks actually
> has better coffee.
>
> Why do so few people know what good coffee is?




 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 14:33:16
From: shane
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
I live in a bit of a coffee wasteland. I am not exagerrating, I swear,
as far as my small city of Duluth goes, this is true. Starbucks is as
good as or better than the rest of the coffee places in my community.
Except one.. Beaner's on Central, they strive to provide good coffee as
well as a nice atmosphere, unfortunately Beaner's is on the other end
of town from me.

We did just get a real Starbucks only 2 or 3 years ago. I am not sure
if the relative newness of the stores makes a difference. The other big
chain here is Caribou Coffee. We have a Dunn Brother's and a number of
independant places that specialize in atmosphere and not in good
coffee. No crema, underextracted shots, lattes and cappucinos with
bubble bath looking foam.

I guess my lament is I would like to be able to out for coffee and
enjoy my purchase. My frustration is so many coffee places just do not
care about quality. To get 90% of the way there and then drop the ball
on the last yard line?

Oh well, such is the way of things... Shane



Dan Bollinger wrote:
> > 98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
> > to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
> > it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
> > perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.
>
> I think you are exagerrating, Shane. Sure, some aren't as good, but almost all
> of them? And, remember what you are comparing them too. I can no longer call
> Starbucks a coffee shop using a straight face. Let's face it. Starbucks is a
> dairy bar that sell deserts on the side. Of course many indies don't measure
> up, and I'm glad they don't. Dan



 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 17:06:13
From: Dan Bollinger
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
> 98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
> to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
> it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
> perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.

I think you are exagerrating, Shane. Sure, some aren't as good, but almost all
of them? And, remember what you are comparing them too. I can no longer call
Starbucks a coffee shop using a straight face. Let's face it. Starbucks is a
dairy bar that sell deserts on the side. Of course many indies don't measure
up, and I'm glad they don't. Dan




  
Date: 17 Dec 2006 23:32:18
From: The Other Funk
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
Finding the keyboard operational
Dan Bollinger entered:

>> 98 percent of the independent coffee shops around seen to only strive
>> to be as good as Starbucks. Why do so very few try to be better? Is
>> it that tough to do? I know nothing about running a business,
>> perhpaps it is difficult to actually do.
>
> I think you are exagerrating, Shane. Sure, some aren't as good, but
> almost all of them? And, remember what you are comparing them too.
> I can no longer call Starbucks a coffee shop using a straight face. Let's
> face it. Starbucks is a dairy bar that sell deserts on the
> side. Of course many indies don't measure up, and I'm glad they
> don't. Dan

Let's be honest, Starbucks is redefining what coffee is. Just like McDonalds
defines hamburgers. They are making money by creating a preception of what
good coffee is and convincing people that they have to have it.
This independant does not "compete" with Starbucks We don't try to be like
them or to be the anti-starbucks.
What we try to be is ourselves. .
I have just as many customers that want us to put some ice in their cup
because our coffee is too hot as want their coffee put in the microwave
because it's too cold. Do I tell them that they are wrong?
The point I am circling around is that thre is no one meaning to "a good cup
of coffee" Yes, there are the quanatative measuremnts of temp, TDS, etc. And
there are those who are professional tasters whose opinions I do not
questions. But only good cup of coffee is the one you like.
Bob
--
--
Coffee worth staying up for - NY Times
www.moondoggiecoffee.com



 
Date: 15 Dec 2006 12:19:46
From: phreaddy
Subject: Re: I just want a good cup of coffee!
Starbucks definitely isn't consistent. I have been to nasty, fillthy
Starbucks with employees who were uncaring at best. And to ones that
were clean, with professionally trained baristas. They used to have
more-consistent, good (if not great) coffee before they switched to
superautomatics where the "barista" is trained only to press
combinations of buttons. Are there some employees who are still
conscientious? Sure. But increasingly fewer, I think.