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Date: 18 Oct 2006 11:42:31
From: bigrdw
Subject: Newbie Taking the Plunge
OK so I miss the coffee bars in Italy. 80 euro cents at this point was
a bargain...I'm tired of faking myself out with the "short coffee" I
make now with my moka pot and I'm longing for something superior to
what I get in the "espresso" bars here in Hawaii.

After moderate research I'm convinced the RANCILIO Silvia, Rocky
Grinder combo, though pricey, is worth every penny and produces
unmatched domestic quality.

I reach out to the masses for a sanity check. Am I overlooking a
better machine? A better grinder? Is Rocky really that much better
than say....Mazzer? even if I was to stick with the Silvia machine?

I'm sure to some, if not most, this topic is very stale. I suppose I'm
just the next newbie in line looking for current feedback before the
big investment.

Cheers,
Rob W.





 
Date: 20 Oct 2006 22:58:56
From: Heat + Beans
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
Lots of people associate the term "espresso" with something faintly
exotic, with high quality, with the gross difference between expensive
and cheap coffee (i.e., starbucks vs folgers). The subtleties of
degree of roast or whether it's used to pull shots or dump into a
percolator are not a factor in the naming. So, I agree, if it's useful
for these folks, let them have their "espresso roast."

On the other hand, might we get amused and mildly annoyed with that?
Sure. It's not "just semantics and pretence," it really matters to
some of us what and how coffee terms are popularly used; and to suggest
anything less is insulting----but insult might be what you had in mind.

I suspect that you have no profound disagreement with Danny's
substance, which is really very hard to dispute, but with his inflated
tone. "[T]hose that peddle the misinformation should be corrected"
sounds like my argument for impeaching George Bush, rather than a
rationale for how to deal with misguided posters.

tin (proud to be a fundamental-leaning post-modern)


Robert Harmon wrote:
> Why do they need correcting Danny? Does it make any difference what anyone
> calls anything or anyone? It's just semantics & pretence; making ourselves
> appear ster (in our own eyes) than others.

> Robert (But of course, I am ster!) Harmon
> http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
> http://tinyurl.com/psfob
> http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r
>
> "Danny" <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com> wrote in message
> news:4psq0iFki50sU1@individual.net...
> >
> > Why is that, then, since he's absolutely right? Espresso is not a roast,
> > and those that peddle the misinformation should be corrected.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Regards, Danny
> >
> > http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
> > http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)
> >



  
Date: 21 Oct 2006 20:38:41
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
Heat + Beans wrote:
-snip-
> I suspect that you have no profound disagreement with Danny's
> substance, which is really very hard to dispute, but with his inflated
> tone. "[T]hose that peddle the misinformation should be corrected"
> sounds like my argument for impeaching George Bush, rather than a
> rationale for how to deal with misguided posters.

No inflated tone was intended. The post was a rebuff to phreaddy who
called North pedantic for explaining what espresso roast is or isn't,
and it isn't a roast, although it has a niche in coffee descriptions
on superket shelves.


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



  
Date: 21 Oct 2006 06:52:24
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
Howdy tin!
What me insult anyone. Crikey, I've been slandered! ;)

Having been associated with groups that are very exacting in their use of
words (except for the one doofus unable to differentiate between metric &
Imperial measurements on a s Lander spec sheet). If they said 'espresso'
within their group everyone would know exactly what they meant.

And within this newsgroup being a stickler for details isn't necessarily
uncalled for, although being a Texan I tend to overlook others' flubs
(nuculiar). But if you're going to be so rigid in the terminology used here
at least do so with a bit of patience & humility. After all, you wouldn't
appreciate being in a group of aerospace engineers who continuously pointed
out your gaffes, would you?
--
Robert (Practically perfect in every way.) Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
http://tinyurl.com/psfob
http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r

"Heat + Beans" <heatgunroast@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1161410336.538097.34590@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
snip
> On the other hand, might we get amused and mildly annoyed with that?
> Sure. It's not "just semantics and pretence," it really matters to
> some of us what and how coffee terms are popularly used; and to suggest
> anything less is insulting----but insult might be what you had in mind.
>
> I suspect that you have no profound disagreement with Danny's
> substance, which is really very hard to dispute, but with his inflated
> tone. "[T]hose that peddle the misinformation should be corrected"
> sounds like my argument for impeaching George Bush, rather than a
> rationale for how to deal with misguided posters.
>
> tin (proud to be a fundamental-leaning post-modern)




   
Date: 21 Oct 2006 20:42:49
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
Robert Harmon wrote:
> Howdy tin!
> What me insult anyone. Crikey, I've been slandered! ;)
>
> Having been associated with groups that are very exacting in their use of
> words (except for the one doofus unable to differentiate between metric &
> Imperial measurements on a s Lander spec sheet). If they said 'espresso'
> within their group everyone would know exactly what they meant.
>
> And within this newsgroup being a stickler for details isn't necessarily
> uncalled for, although being a Texan I tend to overlook others' flubs
> (nuculiar). But if you're going to be so rigid in the terminology used here
> at least do so with a bit of patience & humility. After all, you wouldn't
> appreciate being in a group of aerospace engineers who continuously pointed
> out your gaffes, would you?

So why get at me? I wasn't the one who called North pedantic for
correcting the misinformation?

This group is about information. Hopefully accurate.

If you take the trouble to read any other of my posts, you'll see I'm
usually as helpful and polite as I can be, historically. But since
this group is on an ever downward spiral (pretty soon you and Dave
will be the only people here, insulting each other) it won't matter if
anyone attempts to keep the inofrmation true.

I'm off.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



    
Date: 21 Oct 2006 19:14:27
From: North Sullivan
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 20:42:49 +0100, Danny
<danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote:


>
>So why get at me? I wasn't the one who called North pedantic for
>correcting the misinformation?
>
>This group is about information. Hopefully accurate.

Thanks for jumping in, Danny.

Due to the subject line, I initially missed this thread which didn't
seem to be about coffee. I don't participate in this newsgroup to
trade barbs, so I really don't have anything to add.

North Sullivan


     
Date: 22 Oct 2006 06:58:13
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
North Sullivan wrote:

> Thanks for jumping in, Danny.
>
> Due to the subject line, I initially missed this thread which didn't
> seem to be about coffee. I don't participate in this newsgroup to
> trade barbs, so I really don't have anything to add.
>
> North Sullivan

I don't know whether it's the language barrier or semantics or what,
but my "correcting misinformation" statement appears to be entirely
misunderstood, since it was aimed at the industry in general and not
any one individual, and was certainly not meant to be insulting,
merely to defend anyone who makes a valid point and is then shot down.

This group spends more time disecting peoples' posts rather than
having a technically challenging discussion these days.


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



      
Date: 22 Oct 2006 10:47:15
From: North Sullivan
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 06:58:13 +0100, Danny
<danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote:

>
>I don't know whether it's the language barrier or semantics or what,
>but my "correcting misinformation" statement appears to be entirely
>misunderstood, since it was aimed at the industry in general and not
>any one individual, and was certainly not meant to be insulting,
>merely to defend anyone who makes a valid point and is then shot down.

That's how I understood it.
>
>This group spends more time disecting peoples' posts rather than
>having a technically challenging discussion these days.

I've stopped reading most of those posts. I spend a lot more time
scanning than skimming. I keep reading because every once in awhile,
there's a gem to be found and information to be learned that I
wouldn't learn otherwise. It's worth hanging around if only to look
for DNS's posts. :-)

North Sullivan





       
Date: 22 Oct 2006 16:36:02
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;) - GIVE IT A REST ALREADY!
C'mon folks, - with a subject tag like this one who'd expect anything but BS
inside? I've always operated under the assumption that if I tag my venting &
BS posts as such no one has any VALID complaint about what's inside. Now if
I were to do as some do & mask my message with a misleading subject tag then
I wouldn't blame anyone who'd want to take a (verbal) shot at me.
--
Robert (Some folks with their over sensitive natures are a pain in the
butt!) Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
http://tinyurl.com/psfob
http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r

"North Sullivan" <northwrites@bluebottle.com > wrote in message
news:q14nj29vh329ed5ffvv4q0p1q4ssmci5vt@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 06:58:13 +0100, Danny
> <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>I don't know whether it's the language barrier or semantics or what,
>>but my "correcting misinformation" statement appears to be entirely
>>misunderstood, since it was aimed at the industry in general and not
>>any one individual, and was certainly not meant to be insulting,
>>merely to defend anyone who makes a valid point and is then shot down.
>
> That's how I understood it.
>>
>>This group spends more time disecting peoples' posts rather than
>>having a technically challenging discussion these days.
>
> I've stopped reading most of those posts. I spend a lot more time
> scanning than skimming. I keep reading because every once in awhile,
> there's a gem to be found and information to be learned that I
> wouldn't learn otherwise. It's worth hanging around if only to look
> for DNS's posts. :-)
>
> North Sullivan
>
>
>




   
Date: 21 Oct 2006 15:55:19
From: Espressopithecus (Java Man)
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
In article <Isj_g.16834$UG4.12958@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net >,
r_h_harmon@Zhotmail.com says...
> After all, you wouldn't
> appreciate being in a group of aerospace engineers who continuously pointed
> out your gaffes, would you?

If you were discussing aerospace engineering, it would be expected.

Rick


 
Date: 20 Oct 2006 01:59:29
From: Todd94590
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
Hi Rob,
Congrats on taking the plunge. Your choices are good, but not what I
personally came up with. coffeegeek.com is a goldmine of info for
what you might like or not.

Hope the quakes don't make you too jittery.

Todd in Vallejo



bigrdw wrote:
> OK so I miss the coffee bars in Italy. 80 euro cents at this point was
> a bargain...I'm tired of faking myself out with the "short coffee" I
> make now with my moka pot and I'm longing for something superior to
> what I get in the "espresso" bars here in Hawaii.
>
> After moderate research I'm convinced the RANCILIO Silvia, Rocky
> Grinder combo, though pricey, is worth every penny and produces
> unmatched domestic quality.
>
> I reach out to the masses for a sanity check. Am I overlooking a
> better machine? A better grinder? Is Rocky really that much better
> than say....Mazzer? even if I was to stick with the Silvia machine?
>
> I'm sure to some, if not most, this topic is very stale. I suppose I'm
> just the next newbie in line looking for current feedback before the
> big investment.
>
> Cheers,
> Rob W.



 
Date: 19 Oct 2006 13:59:32
From: phreaddy
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
North Sullivan wrote:
> Espresso is not a roast; it's a method for extracting nectar from the
> bean. Espresso beans can be roasted light, roasted dark, or blended
> with light, dark and/or in-between.

Taking pedantry to such an extreme makes one look ridiculous. What you
mean to say is that there isn't a single, generally excepted roast
specific to making espresso. But that certainly doesn't mean that
"espresso is not a roast." If a roaster makes a particular roast, or
blend, and wants to call it an espresso roast, then that's what it is,
whether or not you choose to like it, buy it, or use it to make
espresso, or press pot for that matter. And the fact is that an awful
lot of roasters make espresso roasts, and most of those are indeed
pretty uniformly dark, and darker than even French or Italian roasts
for that matter. (Full disclosure: I generally prefer a much lighter
roast than what is typically characterized as an espresso roast.)



  
Date: 20 Oct 2006 21:31:46
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
phreaddy wrote:
> North Sullivan wrote:
>
>>Espresso is not a roast; it's a method for extracting nectar from the
>>bean. Espresso beans can be roasted light, roasted dark, or blended
>>with light, dark and/or in-between.
>
>
> Taking pedantry to such an extreme makes one look ridiculous. -snip-



Why is that, then, since he's absolutely right? Espresso is not a
roast, and those that peddle the misinformation should be corrected.


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



   
Date: 20 Oct 2006 20:40:53
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
Why do they need correcting Danny? Does it make any difference what anyone
calls anything or anyone? It's just semantics & pretence; making ourselves
appear ster (in our own eyes) than others.
--
Robert (But of course, I am ster!) Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
http://tinyurl.com/psfob
http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r

"Danny" <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote in message
news:4psq0iFki50sU1@individual.net...
>
> Why is that, then, since he's absolutely right? Espresso is not a roast,
> and those that peddle the misinformation should be corrected.
>
>
> --
> Regards, Danny
>
> http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
> http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)
>




    
Date: 21 Oct 2006 20:36:12
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
Robert Harmon wrote:
> Why do they need correcting Danny? Does it make any difference what anyone
> calls anything or anyone? It's just semantics & pretence; making ourselves
> appear ster (in our own eyes) than others.

I disagree. Following your analysis you may as well call anything
espresso that is brown and was pressed somehow (if even that), yet we
all know what a good espresso is, and strive to either make it, or get
served it, or serve it (in my case).

phreaddy called North pedantic for correcting the description of an
"espresso roast". I'm correcting phreaddy so he is a little more
knowledgeable too.

Misinformation is what drives the ket downwards, from *$
mis-describing drinks to mega-corps mis-selling hardware and
consumables as espresso.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



    
Date: 20 Oct 2006 22:24:10
From: Espressopithecus (Java Man)
Subject: Re: Plunging it in! ;)
In article <pva_g.12166$Y24.7743@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net >,
r_h_harmon@Zhotmail.com says...
> Why do they need correcting Danny?

They don't, so long as people come here for misinformation.

Rick


  
Date: 20 Oct 2006 17:11:44
From: Espressopithecus (Java Man)
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
In article <1161291572.802288.238730@f16g2000cwb.googlegroups.com >,
phreaddy@gmail.com says...
> Taking pedantry to such an extreme makes one look ridiculous. What you
> mean to say is that there isn't a single, generally excepted roast
> specific to making espresso. But that certainly doesn't mean that
> "espresso is not a roast." If a roaster makes a particular roast, or
> blend, and wants to call it an espresso roast, then that's what it is,
> whether or not you choose to like it, buy it, or use it to make
> espresso, or press pot for that matter.
>
Calling a roast "Fred" does not make it Fred, although I suspect most
people wouldn't be confused by that. But calling a roast "espresso"
when espresso is NOT a roast, but is coffee made by a very specific
preparation method that has nothing whatever to do with the roast, IS
confusing. You may call pointing this out pedantry, but that doesn't
make it pedantry, either. ;-)

Rick


 
Date: 18 Oct 2006 22:26:01
From: bigrdw
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
Thanks for the advice Rick. There are a few sources of beans here on
Oahu. Can you define "freshly roasted"? 1 - 2 days?


Espressopithecus (Java Man) wrote:
> In article <1161196951.707390.121450@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>,
> austy92@gmail.com says...
> > OK so I miss the coffee bars in Italy. 80 euro cents at this point was
> > a bargain...I'm tired of faking myself out with the "short coffee" I
> > make now with my moka pot and I'm longing for something superior to
> > what I get in the "espresso" bars here in Hawaii.
> >
> > After moderate research I'm convinced the RANCILIO Silvia, Rocky
> > Grinder combo, though pricey, is worth every penny
>
> I agree.
>
> > and produces
> > unmatched domestic quality.
>
> No. Very good quality for the initial investment. But there are other
> alternatives for a little less, and much better alternatives for more.
> And without a source of freshly roasted beans, the "return on
> investment" will be very low.
> >
> > I reach out to the masses for a sanity check. Am I overlooking a
> > better machine? A better grinder? Is Rocky really that much better
> > than say....Mazzer? even if I was to stick with the Silvia machine?
>
> Rocky is not the equal of the Mazzer. Period. Nor of the similarly
> priced Macap. You'd get better output from a Silvia with either of
> these grinders, and there are others that are better than the Rocky,
> some in its price range.
> >
> > I'm sure to some, if not most, this topic is very stale. I suppose I'm
> > just the next newbie in line looking for current feedback before the
> > big investment.
> >
> I suggest you head on over to www.coffeegeek.com and/or use Google to
> search alt.coffee. You have a lot of learning to do, and it can be done
> relatively easily.
>
> Rick



  
Date: 18 Oct 2006 23:30:54
From: Cordovero
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
Freshly roasted = used within 2 weeks (and always ground fresh just before
use).

C

"bigrdw" <austy92@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1161235561.692165.6780@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> Thanks for the advice Rick. There are a few sources of beans here on
> Oahu. Can you define "freshly roasted"? 1 - 2 days?
>
>
> Espressopithecus (Java Man) wrote:
>> In article <1161196951.707390.121450@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>,
>> austy92@gmail.com says...
>> > OK so I miss the coffee bars in Italy. 80 euro cents at this point was
>> > a bargain...I'm tired of faking myself out with the "short coffee" I
>> > make now with my moka pot and I'm longing for something superior to
>> > what I get in the "espresso" bars here in Hawaii.
>> >
>> > After moderate research I'm convinced the RANCILIO Silvia, Rocky
>> > Grinder combo, though pricey, is worth every penny
>>
>> I agree.
>>
>> > and produces
>> > unmatched domestic quality.
>>
>> No. Very good quality for the initial investment. But there are other
>> alternatives for a little less, and much better alternatives for more.
>> And without a source of freshly roasted beans, the "return on
>> investment" will be very low.
>> >
>> > I reach out to the masses for a sanity check. Am I overlooking a
>> > better machine? A better grinder? Is Rocky really that much better
>> > than say....Mazzer? even if I was to stick with the Silvia machine?
>>
>> Rocky is not the equal of the Mazzer. Period. Nor of the similarly
>> priced Macap. You'd get better output from a Silvia with either of
>> these grinders, and there are others that are better than the Rocky,
>> some in its price range.
>> >
>> > I'm sure to some, if not most, this topic is very stale. I suppose I'm
>> > just the next newbie in line looking for current feedback before the
>> > big investment.
>> >
>> I suggest you head on over to www.coffeegeek.com and/or use Google to
>> search alt.coffee. You have a lot of learning to do, and it can be done
>> relatively easily.
>>
>> Rick
>




 
Date: 18 Oct 2006 12:53:46
From:
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge

Hawaii has excellent coffee, although not much emphasis on espresso.
Many there consider it a waste to make espresso with such smooth beans.
I remember one excellent coffee shop on the Big Island from our
honeymoion (this is 1999, so it may not be there anymore) called
Meggie's, I think. (No, not "Maggie's".) Of the Kona coffees, our
favorite was Country Samurai, followed by Kona Blue Sky. Of course
there are other excellent Konas, but I can personally attest to these
two as we occasionally still order these as gifts for people. Molokai
Coffee on (where else?) Molokai is also a very good coffee, and perhaps
the best dark-roast in the Islands. (Their dark roast is called
Muleskinner.) I see they also have an espresso roast now. Haven't tried
it.



  
Date: 22 Oct 2006 14:48:19
From: bigrdw
Subject: Re: Newbie taking the Plunge
Well Folks,
Being the originator of the string, I was hoping for something more
than BS inside of it...and fortunately I wasn't disappointed...of
course my learning curve is bottom left of the bell right now. Thanks
for the few suggestions I did receive and "edjamakashun" on beans and
roast.

Between coffeegeeks and the entertaining aspect of this forum, it's
obvious there's alot to be discovered in the espresso world (not
surprising, based on how new the technique is.

Cheers,
Rob (going for another bowl of popcorn) W.


Robert Harmon wrote:
> C'mon folks, - with a subject tag like this one who'd expect anything but BS
> inside? I've always operated under the assumption that if I tag my venting &
> BS posts as such no one has any VALID complaint about what's inside. Now if
> I were to do as some do & mask my message with a misleading subject tag then
> I wouldn't blame anyone who'd want to take a (verbal) shot at me.
> --
> Robert (Some folks with their over sensitive natures are a pain in the
> butt!) Harmon
> http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
> http://tinyurl.com/psfob
> http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r
>
> "North Sullivan" <northwrites@bluebottle.com> wrote in message
> news:q14nj29vh329ed5ffvv4q0p1q4ssmci5vt@4ax.com...
> > On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 06:58:13 +0100, Danny
> > <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>I don't know whether it's the language barrier or semantics or what,
> >>but my "correcting misinformation" statement appears to be entirely
> >>misunderstood, since it was aimed at the industry in general and not
> >>any one individual, and was certainly not meant to be insulting,
> >>merely to defend anyone who makes a valid point and is then shot down.
> >
> > That's how I understood it.
> >>
> >>This group spends more time disecting peoples' posts rather than
> >>having a technically challenging discussion these days.
> >
> > I've stopped reading most of those posts. I spend a lot more time
> > scanning than skimming. I keep reading because every once in awhile,
> > there's a gem to be found and information to be learned that I
> > wouldn't learn otherwise. It's worth hanging around if only to look
> > for DNS's posts. :-)
> >
> > North Sullivan
> >
> >
> >



  
Date: 18 Oct 2006 16:45:17
From: North Sullivan
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
On 18 Oct 2006 12:53:46 -0700, saltisland@hotmail.com wrote:
(snip)
>Coffee on (where else?) Molokai is also a very good coffee, and perhaps
>the best dark-roast in the Islands. (Their dark roast is called
>Muleskinner.) I see they also have an espresso roast now. Haven't tried
>it.
Espresso is not a roast; it's a method for extracting nectar from the
bean. Espresso beans can be roasted light, roasted dark, or blended
with light, dark and/or in-between.

North Sullivan



   
Date: 21 Oct 2006 16:29:32
From: Dave S
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
North Sullivan wrote:
> On 18 Oct 2006 12:53:46 -0700, saltisland@hotmail.com wrote:
> (snip)
>> Coffee on (where else?) Molokai is also a very good coffee, and perhaps
>> the best dark-roast in the Islands. (Their dark roast is called
>> Muleskinner.) I see they also have an espresso roast now. Haven't tried
>> it.
> Espresso is not a roast; it's a method for extracting nectar from the
> bean. Espresso beans can be roasted light, roasted dark, or blended
> with light, dark and/or in-between.
>
> North Sullivan

So if espresso is not a roast, which is not a statement I have any
argument with, is there really an espresso bean?

Dave S.


    
Date: 21 Oct 2006 22:05:22
From: Espressopithecus (Java Man)
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
In article <fiw_g.5298$VN1.3319@newsfe16.lga >, dabcschell@mts.not
says...
> North Sullivan wrote:
> > On 18 Oct 2006 12:53:46 -0700, saltisland@hotmail.com wrote:
> > (snip)
> >> Coffee on (where else?) Molokai is also a very good coffee, and perhaps
> >> the best dark-roast in the Islands. (Their dark roast is called
> >> Muleskinner.) I see they also have an espresso roast now. Haven't tried
> >> it.
> > Espresso is not a roast; it's a method for extracting nectar from the
> > bean. Espresso beans can be roasted light, roasted dark, or blended
> > with light, dark and/or in-between.
> >
> > North Sullivan
>
> So if espresso is not a roast, which is not a statement I have any
> argument with, is there really an espresso bean?
>
No, just as there is such a thing as "doughnut wheat".

Rick


    
Date: 21 Oct 2006 22:38:47
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
Dave S wrote:

> So if espresso is not a roast, which is not a statement I have any
> argument with, is there really an espresso bean?
>
> Dave S.

Not really. Espresso, as it relates to the coffee, is merely a blend
that performs well in the brewing process, or a single origin, but
commercially at least, it's a blend that has the necessary qualities
to allow good crema, and a taste that either is suitable as a straight
espresso, or one that can cut through milk drinks. Some single
origins (see the archives) have been found to produce a good espresso,
but I don't know of a single bean that is renowned for it's espresso
qualities, other than Brazils, which are used as a base for many
commercial blends. Others with cupping skills will be along to tell
you what origins make a good espresso, or to correct me, at least.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



     
Date: 22 Oct 2006 03:12:42
From: Donn Cave
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
Quoth Danny <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com >:


      
Date: 21 Oct 2006 22:37:02
From: Harry Moos
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
That is exactly what my friend thought when he bought "espresso roast" beans
for his new Bunn drip machine. Of course, his only knowledge of espresso
came from a recent visit to Italy. He didn't really like it there, but he
was curious to see what would happen if he tried to make it at home. Now,
he is not an internet user nor a coffee connoiseur; until his kids got the
Bunn for him, he drank percolator coffee. He is old school about throwing
anything out, so he used those beans anyway. After the first attempt, I
asked for iced tea until he finished the whole pound -- which took awhile
because no one else would drink it. He is using flavored coffee now.

"Donn Cave" <donn@drizzle.com > wrote in message
news:1161486762.6840@bubbleator.drizzle.com...
> If people think an espresso roast will make them able to produce
> espresso from a filter machine, they probably also think that a swim
> suit will make them able to swim.
>
> Donn




   
Date: 18 Oct 2006 17:58:50
From: Harry Moos
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
True, but it is sometimes sold labelled "Espresso Roast." The local
superket carries dark whole beans simply called "Espresso Roast" [not
"Espresso Blend"]. I made the mistake of trying them once. I have a friend
who used to buy them for drip coffee -- a really vile concoction.

"North Sullivan" <northwrites@bluebottle.com > wrote in message
news:oq7dj21vgstsiu8ljf0hrtvcglj4s89r7k@4ax.com...
>
> Espresso is not a roast; it's a method for extracting nectar from the
> bean. Espresso beans can be roasted light, roasted dark, or blended
> with light, dark and/or in-between.
>
> North Sullivan
>




    
Date: 18 Oct 2006 17:05:09
From: Cordovero
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge

"Harry Moos" <harrym@ruraltel.net > wrote in message
news:9KKdnZTN2ZY4LKvYnZ2dnUVZ_rmdnZ2d@news.ruraltel.net...
> True, but it is sometimes sold labelled "Espresso Roast."

I believe that was a term coined by Italian immigrants selling overroasted
beans for espresso in the days before good quality beans were available.

C




 
Date: 18 Oct 2006 11:55:19
From: wally1012
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge

bigrdw wrote:
> OK so I miss the coffee bars in Italy. 80 euro cents at this point was
> a bargain...I'm tired of faking myself out with the "short coffee" I
> make now with my moka pot and I'm longing for something superior to
> what I get in the "espresso" bars here in Hawaii.
>
> After moderate research I'm convinced the RANCILIO Silvia, Rocky
> Grinder combo, though pricey, is worth every penny and produces
> unmatched domestic quality.
>
> I reach out to the masses for a sanity check. Am I overlooking a
> better machine? A better grinder? Is Rocky really that much better
> than say....Mazzer? even if I was to stick with the Silvia machine?
>
> I'm sure to some, if not most, this topic is very stale. I suppose I'm
> just the next newbie in line looking for current feedback before the
> big investment.
>
> Cheers,

You need a good quality source for your coffee without that save your
money

Wally



 
Date: 18 Oct 2006 18:49:38
From: Espressopithecus (Java Man)
Subject: Re: Newbie Taking the Plunge
In article <1161196951.707390.121450@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com >,
austy92@gmail.com says...
> OK so I miss the coffee bars in Italy. 80 euro cents at this point was
> a bargain...I'm tired of faking myself out with the "short coffee" I
> make now with my moka pot and I'm longing for something superior to
> what I get in the "espresso" bars here in Hawaii.
>
> After moderate research I'm convinced the RANCILIO Silvia, Rocky
> Grinder combo, though pricey, is worth every penny

I agree.

> and produces
> unmatched domestic quality.

No. Very good quality for the initial investment. But there are other
alternatives for a little less, and much better alternatives for more.
And without a source of freshly roasted beans, the "return on
investment" will be very low.
>
> I reach out to the masses for a sanity check. Am I overlooking a
> better machine? A better grinder? Is Rocky really that much better
> than say....Mazzer? even if I was to stick with the Silvia machine?

Rocky is not the equal of the Mazzer. Period. Nor of the similarly
priced Macap. You'd get better output from a Silvia with either of
these grinders, and there are others that are better than the Rocky,
some in its price range.
>
> I'm sure to some, if not most, this topic is very stale. I suppose I'm
> just the next newbie in line looking for current feedback before the
> big investment.
>
I suggest you head on over to www.coffeegeek.com and/or use Google to
search alt.coffee. You have a lot of learning to do, and it can be done
relatively easily.

Rick