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Date: 20 Apr 2007 09:56:54
From: Joe
Subject: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
for a moment.

You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
<i >mark</i> of foam.

"I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
"No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
"Yes, please! That sounds great!"

Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"

Sad,

Joe





 
Date: 27 Apr 2007 19:36:37
From: Douglas W Hoyt
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
When I'm travelling I would estimate that 80% of the time 'Espresso
Macchiato' is listed at Starbucks on the big board under the 'espresso'
section of the menu--at plain espresso prices. Pay a dollar more and you
get a mess of warm milk and you have a "cappucino" (get a "venti" and you're
set for dairy intake for the week). Of the 20% of Starbucks that do not
have espresso macchiato listed, 70% still actually know how to make one, and
the rest of the time you have to walk them through it. It helps for
intelligibility to say "DOH-ppio" like Homer Simpson would say when
ordering, instead of the short vowel sound.




 
Date: 23 Apr 2007 13:58:04
From: Joe
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On Apr 20, 12:56 pm, Joe <Joe.He...@gmail.com > wrote:
> Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
> for a moment.
>
> You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
> I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
> space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
> <i>mark</i> of foam.
>
> "I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
> "No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
> top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
> whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
> razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
> "Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>
> Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
> Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
> Sad,
>
> Joe

I went to work that day and got more orders for Starbuck's style
Macchiatos than I've ever received before. Don't tempt the
universe...it has a great sense of humor :)

Joe



 
Date: 23 Apr 2007 10:18:42
From: shane
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On Apr 21, 5:21 pm, r...@math.hawaii.NOSPAM.edu (D. Ross) wrote:
> "Jack Denver" <nunuv...@netscape.net> wrote:
>
>


 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 19:21:26
From: shane
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
I just had a discussion about "Macchiatos". I started to describe to
someone at the espresso bar at church a "macchiato" is an espresso
touched by a spoonful of foam.
The guy I was talking is a periodic college exchange teacher in
Florence, he will work in Italy for a semester and then come back. He
told me that "well in Florence a Macciato is equal parts espresso and
steamed milk". End of discussion, How could I argue with that?

Shane


On Apr 20, 5:38 pm, "I- >Ian" <some...@nowhere.com> wrote:
> On 20 Apr 2007 09:56:54 -0700, Joe <Joe.He...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
> >for a moment.
>
> >You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
> >I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
> >space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
> ><i>mark</i> of foam.
>
> >"I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
> >"No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
> >top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
> >whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
> >razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
> >"Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>
> >Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
> >Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
> >Sad,
>
> >Joe
>
> Pity the poor bloke who knows macchiato and is served a pitcher of
> dirty foam at *$ or CBTL...
>
> ...the first, and last, time it happend :
> "What the [expletive deleted] is this?!?!?!"- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -




  
Date: 21 Apr 2007 08:31:34
From: D. Ross
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
shane <shane.olson@juno.com > wrote:



   
Date: 21 Apr 2007 12:11:32
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
Wikipedia also mentions the 1:1 ratio as the "new" macchiato:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caff%C3%A8_macchiato

I haven't been to Florence in several years so I can't say one way or the
other but in general Italy is not immune from outside trends (in fact very
connected to the modern world and what is happening elsewhere, though
usually such developments are filtered and adapted to suit the Italian
taste) so I wouldn't be shocked if certain "hip" bars were doing 1:1
macchiatos (note that this still falls far short of the Starbucks milk
ratio). I understand in certain cities the "latte" has caught on and not
just as a drink for invalids and children.

"D. Ross" <ross@math.hawaii.NOSPAM.edu > wrote in message
news:4629c9bc.52637638@localhost...
> shane <shane.olson@juno.com> wrote:
>
>


    
Date: 21 Apr 2007 22:21:13
From: D. Ross
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote:



 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 15:38:11
From: I->Ian
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On 20 Apr 2007 09:56:54 -0700, Joe <Joe.Heide@gmail.com > wrote:

>Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
>for a moment.
>
>You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
>I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
>space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
><i>mark</i> of foam.
>
>"I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
>"No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
>top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
>whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
>razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
>"Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>
>Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
>Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
>Sad,
>
>Joe

Pity the poor bloke who knows macchiato and is served a pitcher of
dirty foam at *$ or CBTL...

...the first, and last, time it happend :
"What the [expletive deleted] is this?!?!?!"


  
Date: 20 Apr 2007 22:14:15
From: daveb
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they? machiatto!
This is just the kind of thing Schulz was whining about recently --

how " . . . .they've lost their way"
(HAH!)

not that ANYTHING change




"I- >Ian" <someone@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:bufi23pj08i7pj4i4nf4vjqsnssqllp1si@4ax.com...
> On 20 Apr 2007 09:56:54 -0700, Joe <Joe.Heide@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
>>for a moment.
>>
>>You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
>>I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
>>space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
>><i>mark</i> of foam.
>>
>>"I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
>>"No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
>>top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
>>whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
>>razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
>>"Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>>
>>Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
>>Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>>
>>Sad,
>>
>>Joe
>
> Pity the poor bloke who knows macchiato and is served a pitcher of
> dirty foam at *$ or CBTL...
>
> ...the first, and last, time it happend :
> "What the [expletive deleted] is this?!?!?!"




 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 12:47:57
From: Joe
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On Apr 20, 3:40 pm, "Jack Denver" <nunuv...@netscape.net > wrote:
> Howard Schultz is like Humpty Dumpty in Alice in Wonderland - words mean
> just what he chooses them to mean, neither more nor less. If Howard says
> that a "macchiato" means a drink with lots of caramel and whipped cream,
> then that's what it means to the public. Venti used to be the number after
> 19 in Italian but now it is a coffee size 'cause Howard said so. 'When I
> make a word do a lot of work like that,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'I always pay
> it extra.' (unlike my baristas, said Howard).
>
> In fairness, it Italy a "caffe'macchiato" is an espresso "stained" with a
> little milk, as you described but a "latte macchiato" is the opposite - a
> glass of steamed milk "stained" with a little coffee - this drink (minus the
> caramel and whipped cream) is the ancestor of the Starbucks "macchiato".

Thanks for the definition of the latte macchiato...that's a new one to
me. Always fun to learn something new.

Joe



 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 20:47:08
From: Danny
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
Joe wrote:
> Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
> for a moment.
>
> You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
> I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
> space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
> <i>mark</i> of foam.
>
> "I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
> "No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
> top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
> whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
> razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
> "Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>
> Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
> Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
> Sad,
>
> Joe
>

Since the straight espresso drinks are above Americano on my menu I
always view with suspicion any order that is a variant on a double
espresso, usually showing them a demitasse and confirming that they
wanted a short drink. 99.999% of the time they wanted a mug of
coffee. Try not to belittle the customer, as the likes of *$ have
destroyed the original meaning of many drinks. I even had someone
come up yesterday and ask if there was a Starbucks nearby <! >

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 12:41:43
From: Joe
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On Apr 20, 2:38 pm, Marshall <mrf...@ihatespamearthlink.net > wrote:
> On 20 Apr 2007 10:30:14 -0700, Joe <Joe.He...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >I actually nicely let them know the definition of a Macchiato and I
> >also offer to make the a latte instead of the Macchiato. I play nice
> >when I'm working (good customer service), because we do have a lot of
> >repeat businesses...I was just venting :)
>
> >Joe
>
> Your customers aren't idiots, they are just mis-educated. You also
> shouldn't forget that the meaning of many foreign words get twisted
> when they cross the Atlantic. Do you ever order a "panini?" Dummy!
> Singular is a "panino." Ever call the main course an "entree" in a
> restaurant? Dummy! It means "appetizers" in France (as in "your
> entrance to the meal"). You get my drift.
>
> I would use a non-judgmental question to keep my customers happy, like
> "Would you like your macchiato Starbucks style or Italian style?" It
> would also start an interesting conversation.
>
> Marshall

I agree with the general vibe that there is an opportunity for
education when it comes to misunderstanding coffee terms...and I do
like your phrasing of "Would you like your macchiato Starbucks style
or Italian style?". It's much nicer and could open a dialogue.

I love espresso, but I don't mind making "cutie" drinks like a caramel
latte with whipped cream...I'm just mad at Starbucks for talking the
name of a drink and applying it to another drink that has nothing to
do with the original. That's really what the post was about...it's not
the customers fault, they're not making this stuff up...they've just
be misinformed by Starbucks.

Joe



 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 15:40:34
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
Howard Schultz is like Humpty Dumpty in Alice in Wonderland - words mean
just what he chooses them to mean, neither more nor less. If Howard says
that a "macchiato" means a drink with lots of caramel and whipped cream,
then that's what it means to the public. Venti used to be the number after
19 in Italian but now it is a coffee size 'cause Howard said so. 'When I
make a word do a lot of work like that,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'I always pay
it extra.' (unlike my baristas, said Howard).

In fairness, it Italy a "caffe'macchiato" is an espresso "stained" with a
little milk, as you described but a "latte macchiato" is the opposite - a
glass of steamed milk "stained" with a little coffee - this drink (minus the
caramel and whipped cream) is the ancestor of the Starbucks "macchiato".





"Joe" <Joe.Heide@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1177088214.559605.242690@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
> for a moment.
>
> You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
> I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
> space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
> <i>mark</i> of foam.
>
> "I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
> "No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
> top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
> whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
> razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
> "Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>
> Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
> Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
> Sad,
>
> Joe
>
>




 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 11:16:28
From: Ross Wentworth
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
Joe wrote:
> Sorry to beat a dead, dead, very dead horse, but I just have to vent
> for a moment.
>
> You could not guess that number of times someone walks in to the shop
> I work at, orders a "Macchiato" and looks at me like I from outer
> space when I bring them a drink that's 2 onces of espresso and a
> <i>mark</i> of foam.
>
> "I though it would be, well...you know, bigger?"
> "No, as the name suggest, it's espresso with a mark of foam on
> top...would like me to make you a one shot, caramel latte with so much
> whipped cream on top that you wouldn't know if the was a Rosetta or a
> razor blade lurking beneath the mountain of whipped cream?"
> "Yes, please! That sounds great!"
>
> Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
> Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
> Sad,
>
> Joe
>

I very close friend loves the starbucks "caramel macchiato" (with extra
carmel). I've been meaning to pick up a squeeze bottle of caramel so I
can the drink for her when she visits. She won't be getting Blue
Mountain espresso, though. I better get whipped cream, too. And lots
of it.

As for your situation, remember, the customer is always right, even if
they are ignorant twits.

--
Ross Wentworth


 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 10:30:14
From: Joe
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On Apr 20, 1:25 pm, Randy G. <f...@DESPAMMOcncnet.com > wrote:
> Joe <Joe.He...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >[snip of complaints about starbies]
> >Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
> >Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
> Joe,
>
> What percentage of those people become repeat/return customers? When
> someone reacts like that (surprise as to the beverage they receive in
> juxtaposition to what they had in mind [prescription, description, and
> expectation misalignment] it is your opportunity to open an
> educational dialogue and to create a customer who becomes empowered by
> knowledge. They then become a spokesperson for your shop. The goal,
> for you, is to stay in business. On the other hand, if you get so much
> foot traffic and first time/only time visitors that it matters not how
> you treat the customers, then it doesn't matter.
>
> You don't have to like the customer- you just have to convince them
> that you do so. ;-)
>
> Randy "sure. just let me bend over for you" G.
> http://www.EspressoMyEspresso.com

I actually nicely let them know the definition of a Macchiato and I
also offer to make the a latte instead of the Macchiato. I play nice
when I'm working (good customer service), because we do have a lot of
repeat businesses...I was just venting :)

Joe



  
Date: 20 Apr 2007 20:26:56
From: Barry Jarrett
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On 20 Apr 2007 10:30:14 -0700, Joe <Joe.Heide@gmail.com > wrote:

>I actually nicely let them know the definition of a Macchiato and I
>also offer to make the a latte instead of the Macchiato.

i'm sure you explain that what you offer is an Espresso Macchiato or
Caffe Macchiato, while the drink they're having at starbucks is a
Latte Macchiato.



  
Date: 20 Apr 2007 18:38:44
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
On 20 Apr 2007 10:30:14 -0700, Joe <Joe.Heide@gmail.com > wrote:

>I actually nicely let them know the definition of a Macchiato and I
>also offer to make the a latte instead of the Macchiato. I play nice
>when I'm working (good customer service), because we do have a lot of
>repeat businesses...I was just venting :)
>
>Joe

Your customers aren't idiots, they are just mis-educated. You also
shouldn't forget that the meaning of many foreign words get twisted
when they cross the Atlantic. Do you ever order a "panini?" Dummy!
Singular is a "panino." Ever call the main course an "entree" in a
restaurant? Dummy! It means "appetizers" in France (as in "your
entrance to the meal"). You get my drift.

I would use a non-judgmental question to keep my customers happy, like
"Would you like your macchiato Starbucks style or Italian style?" It
would also start an interesting conversation.

Marshall


 
Date: 20 Apr 2007 10:25:50
From: Randy G.
Subject: Re: No one's bashed Starbucks on Alt.Coffee...have they?
Joe <Joe.Heide@gmail.com > wrote:

>[snip of complaints about starbies]
>Unfortunately, I've developed the habit of asking, "Do you want a real
>Macchiato or a Starbucks Macchiato?"
>
Joe,

What percentage of those people become repeat/return customers? When
someone reacts like that (surprise as to the beverage they receive in
juxtaposition to what they had in mind [prescription, description, and
expectation misalignment] it is your opportunity to open an
educational dialogue and to create a customer who becomes empowered by
knowledge. They then become a spokesperson for your shop. The goal,
for you, is to stay in business. On the other hand, if you get so much
foot traffic and first time/only time visitors that it matters not how
you treat the customers, then it doesn't matter.

You don't have to like the customer- you just have to convince them
that you do so. ;-)


Randy "sure. just let me bend over for you" G.
http://www.EspressoMyEspresso.com