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Date: 31 Dec 2006 10:54:28
From: Harry Ipema
Subject: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
"newest" Professional model.




 
Date: 01 Jan 2007 07:13:06
From: daveb
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
" I do [have] another another question and would still like feedback on
USA-based online stores; . . "

Only store I've ever dealt with that carries this -- Whole Latte Love
and they are OK.
I have zero experience with any others that carry LP.


" . . .why do the 220 models appear to be less
expensive than the 120 models? "

A guess: they sell far fwer 120 volt -- US + CDN than they sell of the
220 -- rest of the world.
lower volumes.

www.hiteechespresso.com
202



 
Date: 01 Jan 2007 10:43:52
From: R Finlay
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
On Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:54:28 GMT, Harry Ipema <ipema@teeitup.com >
wrote:

>I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>"newest" Professional model.


I have a Gaggia Classic at home (London) but am spending much time in
Belfast at the moment and missed good Coffee.....so I bought a second
hand La Pavoni Professional on Ebay.

I have not got around to getting a grinder yet (yes...I know!). Will
go for a Gaggia MDF when I do.

The point about multiple shots is well made; but that's not a problem
for me as it's mosty used for one shot only. I would resort to a damp
cloth if needed.

I find the Coffee quality fine and would recommend the machine - it's
a pleasure to look at and to use. Oh, and the steaming function is
much superior as compared with the Gaggia.

Kind regards
Nicholas


  
Date: 01 Jan 2007 12:09:50
From: Harry Ipema
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
Nicholas,

Thanks for those comments. Having just returned from London two days
ago (before the storms and after the fog) I have to agree with your
points. For me, I'm interested in one or two shots at a time with
rare, and I do mean rare, occasions of more than that.

I do another another question and would still like feedback on
USA-based online stores; why do the 220 models appear to be less
expensive than the 120 models?

On Mon, 01 Jan 2007 10:43:52 +0000, R Finlay <nicholas-at-finlay.name >
wrote:

>On Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:54:28 GMT, Harry Ipema <ipema@teeitup.com>
>wrote:
>
>>I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>>"newest" Professional model.
>
>
>I have a Gaggia Classic at home (London) but am spending much time in
>Belfast at the moment and missed good Coffee.....so I bought a second
>hand La Pavoni Professional on Ebay.
>
>I have not got around to getting a grinder yet (yes...I know!). Will
>go for a Gaggia MDF when I do.
>
>The point about multiple shots is well made; but that's not a problem
>for me as it's mosty used for one shot only. I would resort to a damp
>cloth if needed.
>
>I find the Coffee quality fine and would recommend the machine - it's
>a pleasure to look at and to use. Oh, and the steaming function is
>much superior as compared with the Gaggia.
>
>Kind regards
>Nicholas


 
Date: 31 Dec 2006 09:39:11
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
Time for my semi-regular peacock post? I get wonderful shots & great
crema from my LP Pro & my old Europiccola. It's all a matter of
technique & consistency.

http://home.earthlink.net/~r_harmon/La%20Pavoni/Europiccola/how%20to%20use.htm

My opinion is that those who can't master the very simple to use
peacock are either too lazy or too developmentally challenged to learn
the procedures demanded by this machine.

Robert (Peacocks rule, E61 owners drool!) Harmon

Ken Wilson wrote:
> "Harry Ipema"
>
> > Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
> > regardless of the years is what I prefer.
> >
> > I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
> > from online providers.
> >
> > On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>IMHO -- don't!
> >>
> >>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
> >>
> >>
> >>Harry Ipema wrote:
> >>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
> >>> "newest" Professional model.
>
>
> What daveb means is that the La pavoni look fantastic - and sales have been
> much hyped by the Bond film where M says "is that all it does?" - but it is
> hard to make decent coffee with it. a friend of mine has one and he jokes
> that he has to have a morning's notice by his daughter if she wants a cuppa
> so that he can get it working properly.
>
> a machine doesn't have to look modern or have modern technology to perform
> well. eg mine has the "famed" E61 head on it, is easier to use, makes
> consistent consecutive shots and steams milk well - and you pull the shot
> with a lever (albeit without requiring the pavoni barmaid cleavage to do it
> justice). Why is it called a "61"? - year of design.....
>
> You can get the eagle (actually i thought the latest was being keted by
> gaggia with a pointy hat on it), lever arm and sheer good looks with a
> machine that will make coffee properly as well.
>
> actually - some 10 yrs ago around here we had a chap who espoused the "being
> one with man and machine" bit on the golden peacock but i haven't seen a
> reasoned pro post since.
>
> I doubt even our professional manual lever man would recommend them - Danny?
>
> ken



 
Date: 31 Dec 2006 08:50:32
From: daveb
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
have you done a google search on this group and the rest of the web?



 
Date: 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18
From: daveb
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
IMHO -- don't!

the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.


Harry Ipema wrote:
> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
> "newest" Professional model.



  
Date: 31 Dec 2006 16:40:55
From: Harry Ipema
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
regardless of the years is what I prefer.

I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
from online providers.

On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com > wrote:

>IMHO -- don't!
>
>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
>
>
>Harry Ipema wrote:
>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>> "newest" Professional model.


   
Date: 31 Dec 2006 12:41:27
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
You are not going to find enough of a cross section of Pavoni owners here to
get a worthwhile answer. I'm not sure you're going to find ANY Pavoni owners
here for the reasons Ken gave.

The Pavoni design has certainly been tried, but for proven, I think about
the only thing that is proven is that it's proven to overheat if you pull
more than a couple of shots. Also its direct lever makes it hard to produce
consistent pressure unless you have the right "touch". The diameter of the
basket is very small and doesn't hold much coffee and you should expect to
pull very short shots. A few fanatics have modified their Pavonis with air
pumps so that you can get enough pressure in the boiler to push the water
into the piston chamber without having to heat the machine to the point of
burning the shots. Another trick is to cool the group head with wet towels.

You have to understand that the old-fashioned appearance of the Pavoni is
not what it seems to be. By the time it was designed in the early '60s
there were already more sophisiticated pump driven machines on the
commercial ket and commercial levers were of a spring driven, not direct
design like the Pavoni (in a commercial machine pulling the lever compresses
a spring and the spring is what push the piston down to draw the shot on the
return stroke). The Pavoni was an effort to scale down and simplify a
commercial lever machine for the home ket and not an entirely successful
one, IMHO. But people love the way that they look - they do make great
countertop/photoshoot/movie set decorations.

If you really want a tried and proven design, get a big old commercial lever
machine but these are usually beat up and massive and not conducive to the
photo shoot look. Also you need drain, plumbing , 240V electricity and/or
gas. But you will get the great shots that your Pavoni won't give you
consistently.




"Harry Ipema" <ipema@teeitup.com > wrote in message
news:3tpfp2hlde8hsci3ohtu38p56070qdsrub@4ax.com...
> Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
> regardless of the years is what I prefer.
>
> I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
> from online providers.
>
> On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>IMHO -- don't!
>>
>>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
>>
>>
>>Harry Ipema wrote:
>>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>>> "newest" Professional model.




    
Date: 31 Dec 2006 12:28:09
From: notbob
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
On 2006-12-31, Jack Denver <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote:

> get a worthwhile answer. I'm not sure you're going to find ANY Pavoni owners
> here for the reasons Ken gave.

I own one, but no longer use it, for all the reasons Jack lists. I
cannot recommend one. There are better machines for less.

nb


    
Date: 31 Dec 2006 18:05:34
From: Brian Colwell
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional

"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:ye-dnVEcKqbVawrYnZ2dnUVZ_q-vnZ2d@comcast.com...
> You are not going to find enough of a cross section of Pavoni owners here
> to get a worthwhile answer. I'm not sure you're going to find ANY Pavoni
> owners here for the reasons Ken gave.
>
> The Pavoni design has certainly been tried, but for proven, I think about
> the only thing that is proven is that it's proven to overheat if you pull
> more than a couple of shots. Also its direct lever makes it hard to
> produce consistent pressure unless you have the right "touch". The
> diameter of the basket is very small and doesn't hold much coffee and you
> should expect to pull very short shots. A few fanatics have modified
> their Pavonis with air pumps so that you can get enough pressure in the
> boiler to push the water into the piston chamber without having to heat
> the machine to the point of burning the shots. Another trick is to cool
> the group head with wet towels.
>
> You have to understand that the old-fashioned appearance of the Pavoni is
> not what it seems to be. By the time it was designed in the early '60s
> there were already more sophisiticated pump driven machines on the
> commercial ket and commercial levers were of a spring driven, not
> direct design like the Pavoni (in a commercial machine pulling the lever
> compresses a spring and the spring is what push the piston down to draw
> the shot on the return stroke). The Pavoni was an effort to scale down and
> simplify a commercial lever machine for the home ket and not an
> entirely successful one, IMHO. But people love the way that they look -
> they do make great countertop/photoshoot/movie set decorations.
>
> If you really want a tried and proven design, get a big old commercial
> lever machine but these are usually beat up and massive and not conducive
> to the photo shoot look. Also you need drain, plumbing , 240V electricity
> and/or gas. But you will get the great shots that your Pavoni won't give
> you consistently.
>
>
>
>
> "Harry Ipema" <ipema@teeitup.com> wrote in message
> news:3tpfp2hlde8hsci3ohtu38p56070qdsrub@4ax.com...
>> Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
>> regardless of the years is what I prefer.
>>
>> I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
>> from online providers.
>>
>> On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>IMHO -- don't!
>>>
>>>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
>>>
>>>
>>>Harry Ipema wrote:
>>>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>>>> "newest" Professional model.
>
That's a pretty accurate description of the Pavoni......I enjoy using it for
pulling shots for myself.....and I am fairly successful....( kinda like
playing the lottery :-)) ).......but if I have friends over, I revert to my
Silvia !

BMC




     
Date: 01 Jan 2007 00:11:25
From: Herb Buschman
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
Why the Silvia over La Pavoni?

On Sun, 31 Dec 2006 18:05:34 GMT, "Brian Colwell" <bcolwell@shaw.ca >
wrote:

>
>"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net> wrote in message
>news:ye-dnVEcKqbVawrYnZ2dnUVZ_q-vnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> You are not going to find enough of a cross section of Pavoni owners here
>> to get a worthwhile answer. I'm not sure you're going to find ANY Pavoni
>> owners here for the reasons Ken gave.
>>
>> The Pavoni design has certainly been tried, but for proven, I think about
>> the only thing that is proven is that it's proven to overheat if you pull
>> more than a couple of shots. Also its direct lever makes it hard to
>> produce consistent pressure unless you have the right "touch". The
>> diameter of the basket is very small and doesn't hold much coffee and you
>> should expect to pull very short shots. A few fanatics have modified
>> their Pavonis with air pumps so that you can get enough pressure in the
>> boiler to push the water into the piston chamber without having to heat
>> the machine to the point of burning the shots. Another trick is to cool
>> the group head with wet towels.
>>
>> You have to understand that the old-fashioned appearance of the Pavoni is
>> not what it seems to be. By the time it was designed in the early '60s
>> there were already more sophisiticated pump driven machines on the
>> commercial ket and commercial levers were of a spring driven, not
>> direct design like the Pavoni (in a commercial machine pulling the lever
>> compresses a spring and the spring is what push the piston down to draw
>> the shot on the return stroke). The Pavoni was an effort to scale down and
>> simplify a commercial lever machine for the home ket and not an
>> entirely successful one, IMHO. But people love the way that they look -
>> they do make great countertop/photoshoot/movie set decorations.
>>
>> If you really want a tried and proven design, get a big old commercial
>> lever machine but these are usually beat up and massive and not conducive
>> to the photo shoot look. Also you need drain, plumbing , 240V electricity
>> and/or gas. But you will get the great shots that your Pavoni won't give
>> you consistently.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Harry Ipema" <ipema@teeitup.com> wrote in message
>> news:3tpfp2hlde8hsci3ohtu38p56070qdsrub@4ax.com...
>>> Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
>>> regardless of the years is what I prefer.
>>>
>>> I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
>>> from online providers.
>>>
>>> On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>IMHO -- don't!
>>>>
>>>>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Harry Ipema wrote:
>>>>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>>>>> "newest" Professional model.
>>
>That's a pretty accurate description of the Pavoni......I enjoy using it for
>pulling shots for myself.....and I am fairly successful....( kinda like
>playing the lottery :-)) ).......but if I have friends over, I revert to my
>Silvia !
>
>BMC
>


      
Date: 01 Jan 2007 02:01:57
From: Brian Colwell
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional

"Herb Buschman" <hbuschman@ravisloe.com > wrote in message
news:0ckgp25a9kmu64psaqp2lv2lq9g5276768@4ax.com...
> Why the Silvia over La Pavoni?
>
> On Sun, 31 Dec 2006 18:05:34 GMT, "Brian Colwell" <bcolwell@shaw.ca>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Jack Denver" <nunuvyer@netscape.net> wrote in message
>>news:ye-dnVEcKqbVawrYnZ2dnUVZ_q-vnZ2d@comcast.com...
>>> You are not going to find enough of a cross section of Pavoni owners
>>> here
>>> to get a worthwhile answer. I'm not sure you're going to find ANY Pavoni
>>> owners here for the reasons Ken gave.
>>>
>>> The Pavoni design has certainly been tried, but for proven, I think
>>> about
>>> the only thing that is proven is that it's proven to overheat if you
>>> pull
>>> more than a couple of shots. Also its direct lever makes it hard to
>>> produce consistent pressure unless you have the right "touch". The
>>> diameter of the basket is very small and doesn't hold much coffee and
>>> you
>>> should expect to pull very short shots. A few fanatics have modified
>>> their Pavonis with air pumps so that you can get enough pressure in the
>>> boiler to push the water into the piston chamber without having to heat
>>> the machine to the point of burning the shots. Another trick is to cool
>>> the group head with wet towels.
>>>
>>> You have to understand that the old-fashioned appearance of the Pavoni
>>> is
>>> not what it seems to be. By the time it was designed in the early '60s
>>> there were already more sophisiticated pump driven machines on the
>>> commercial ket and commercial levers were of a spring driven, not
>>> direct design like the Pavoni (in a commercial machine pulling the lever
>>> compresses a spring and the spring is what push the piston down to draw
>>> the shot on the return stroke). The Pavoni was an effort to scale down
>>> and
>>> simplify a commercial lever machine for the home ket and not an
>>> entirely successful one, IMHO. But people love the way that they look -
>>> they do make great countertop/photoshoot/movie set decorations.
>>>
>>> If you really want a tried and proven design, get a big old commercial
>>> lever machine but these are usually beat up and massive and not
>>> conducive
>>> to the photo shoot look. Also you need drain, plumbing , 240V
>>> electricity
>>> and/or gas. But you will get the great shots that your Pavoni won't give
>>> you consistently.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Harry Ipema" <ipema@teeitup.com> wrote in message
>>> news:3tpfp2hlde8hsci3ohtu38p56070qdsrub@4ax.com...
>>>> Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
>>>> regardless of the years is what I prefer.
>>>>
>>>> I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
>>>> from online providers.
>>>>
>>>> On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>IMHO -- don't!
>>>>>
>>>>>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Harry Ipema wrote:
>>>>>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>>>>>> "newest" Professional model.
>>>
>>That's a pretty accurate description of the Pavoni......I enjoy using it
>>for
>>pulling shots for myself.....and I am fairly successful....( kinda like
>>playing the lottery :-)) ).......but if I have friends over, I revert to
>>my
>>Silvia !
>>
>>BMC

I find if you have to pull a number of shots, 4or5 for example, the quality
drops off, mainly from overheating.
People have suggested applying cold cloths to cool it down, if it was my
only machine I might try it !

Regards,
BMC




      
Date: 01 Jan 2007 00:47:33
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
Howdy Herb!

Why a Silvia? Maybe so you can be targeted by the pro-PID crowd. Why would
anyone buy a machine that requires a $200 - $300 upgrade to be usable?

Robert (Not anti-Silvia, just pro peacock.) Harmon

"Herb Buschman" <hbuschman@ravisloe.com > wrote in message
news:0ckgp25a9kmu64psaqp2lv2lq9g5276768@4ax.com...
> Why the Silvia over La Pavoni?
>



   
Date: 31 Dec 2006 17:02:54
From: Ken Wilson
Subject: Re: Recommendation? Best place/price for La Pavoni Professional
"Harry Ipema"

> Thanks but I've already decided that a tried and proven design
> regardless of the years is what I prefer.
>
> I was hoping to get responses about the best price and performance
> from online providers.
>
> On 31 Dec 2006 04:36:18 -0800, "daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>IMHO -- don't!
>>
>>the same 'ol design for the last 40+ years.
>>
>>
>>Harry Ipema wrote:
>>> I'm interested and would like your experiences about purchasing the
>>> "newest" Professional model.


What daveb means is that the La pavoni look fantastic - and sales have been
much hyped by the Bond film where M says "is that all it does?" - but it is
hard to make decent coffee with it. a friend of mine has one and he jokes
that he has to have a morning's notice by his daughter if she wants a cuppa
so that he can get it working properly.

a machine doesn't have to look modern or have modern technology to perform
well. eg mine has the "famed" E61 head on it, is easier to use, makes
consistent consecutive shots and steams milk well - and you pull the shot
with a lever (albeit without requiring the pavoni barmaid cleavage to do it
justice). Why is it called a "61"? - year of design.....

You can get the eagle (actually i thought the latest was being keted by
gaggia with a pointy hat on it), lever arm and sheer good looks with a
machine that will make coffee properly as well.

actually - some 10 yrs ago around here we had a chap who espoused the "being
one with man and machine" bit on the golden peacock but i haven't seen a
reasoned pro post since.

I doubt even our professional manual lever man would recommend them - Danny?

ken