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Date: 05 Jan 2007 08:56:34
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing
Some time back I'd posted about my unexpectedly good results with a protein
fortified skim milk I was using in cappas. Over time I found the results to
be variable over the course of the year, and what's more, the local grocery
stores all stopped carrying it, so I was back to square one.

Since then, I've "compromised" on 2% milk for cappas and whole milk for
macchiatos (normally I drink one of each every day). But I have found a
difference in the frothing quality in the various sorts of 2% milk available
to me. The only one that foams well, consistently, is an ultrapasteurized
milk that has a refrigerated shelf life on the order of 6 or 8 weeks. The
former "Trim Deluxe," fortified skim milk I'd used, also was
ultrapasteurized.

I recall reading some other posts here having to do with the superiority of
UHT milk for frothing; I think that Danny uses this exclusively. UHT milk
(which has a long shelf life and is stored at room temperature) is of course
not the same product as what I'm using, but still it is presumably exposed
to high temperatures for a short period of time in the pasteurization
process.

My impression now is that there is something to the pasteurization process,
to ultra pasteurization, that changes the milk in some way and makes
frothing results better.

Am I on to something?

ken






 
Date: 05 Jan 2007 14:19:37
From: DavidMLewis
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing

Ken Fox wrote:
> Some time back I'd posted about my unexpectedly good results with a protein
> fortified skim milk I was using in cappas. Over time I found the results to
> be variable over the course of the year, and what's more, the local grocery
> stores all stopped carrying it, so I was back to square one.
>
Hi Ken,

I've always found the ultrapasteurized milks to have a slight burnt
taste, but I think people have differing sensitivities to that. What I
do is to get non-instant (i.e. freeze-dried) nonfat milk powder at a
local natural-foods store. It has to be non-instant so as not to have a
grainy texture; this stuff is like talc. I use a blender to add two
tablespoons per quart of whole milk, and it makes foaming much easier.
It's the equivalent of protein-fortified.

Best,
David



  
Date: 05 Jan 2007 15:34:14
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing
"DavidMLewis" <DavidMLewis@mac.com > wrote in message
news:1168035577.064473.103270@s80g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
>>
> Hi Ken,
>
> I've always found the ultrapasteurized milks to have a slight burnt
> taste, but I think people have differing sensitivities to that. What I
> do is to get non-instant (i.e. freeze-dried) nonfat milk powder at a
> local natural-foods store. It has to be non-instant so as not to have a
> grainy texture; this stuff is like talc. I use a blender to add two
> tablespoons per quart of whole milk, and it makes foaming much easier.
> It's the equivalent of protein-fortified.
>
> Best,
> David
>

Hi David,

I use unadulterated whole milk for my macchiatos and I'm quite happy with
the results I get from that. I'm also happy with the results of the
Ultrapasteurized 2% milk I use in cappas. Perhaps they could be improved
with the product you mention but I doubt I can find it locally, given where
I live. The next time I'm in a health foods type store I'll look for the
product.

What I was commenting about was my unexpected finding that the
ultrapasteurized 2% froths a helluva lot better than the "fresh" stuff.

ken




 
Date: 05 Jan 2007 12:24:18
From: Amy F.
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing

> My impression now is that there is something to the pasteurization process,
> to ultra pasteurization, that changes the milk in some way and makes
> frothing results better.
>

Foam is an emulsion of air and the proteins in milk. But the proteins
have to be denatured - which happens through heating the milk - before
they can emulsify. (This is why it's incredibly difficult to froth raw,
unpasteurized milk. The heat that happens in frothing is evidently not
hot enough for long enough to denature enough proteins to create a good
foam. A researcher at UC Davis did a study of this a while back.) So...
my guess would be that UHT milk has a higher proportion of denatured
proteins than ordinary pasteurized milk and thus it foams easier. Don't
know if that's true, though. It's just a guess. There are milk
scientists you can consult if you're really dying to know.



 
Date: 05 Jan 2007 14:27:38
From: Jack Denver
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing
There are 3 kinds of pasteurization - just plain pasteurized (the regular
milk you buy in the superket with 2 week shelflife), utra (this is
packaged like the regular and must be kept refrigerated but they use it for
the higher priced and slower moving "specialty milks - lactose reduced
(another good foamer), protein fortified, etc. and has a shelf life of a
couple of months) and UHT (for the room temp brick packs ). Each one is done
at increasingly high temperatures (for increasing short amounts of time) and
results in an increasing % of bacteria that are killed (UHT is essentially
sterilized and not just pasteurized - i.e. 100% of the bacteria are killed
so there is no possibility of regrowth no matter the storage temp - that is
why it doesn't require refrigeration before opening - it is essentially a
modern version of the "canning" process. Pasteurization knocks the
bacterial counts way down (99+%) but doesn't kill all organisms - it takes a
while for the colonies to re-multiply in the cold and as long as the counts
remain relatively low the milk is safe)



I suspect that pre-cooking the proteins must have a beneficial effect on
foaming. The UHT tends to have too much of a "cooked" taste so I don't like
it. The ultras seem to be the best compromise, with taste almost as good as
regular and better foaming, the one downside being that they seem to cost
double what regular milk costs.





"Ken Fox" <morceaudemerdeThisMerdeGoes@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:507anpF1brnprU1@mid.individual.net...
> Some time back I'd posted about my unexpectedly good results with a
> protein fortified skim milk I was using in cappas. Over time I found the
> results to be variable over the course of the year, and what's more, the
> local grocery stores all stopped carrying it, so I was back to square one.
>
> Since then, I've "compromised" on 2% milk for cappas and whole milk for
> macchiatos (normally I drink one of each every day). But I have found a
> difference in the frothing quality in the various sorts of 2% milk
> available to me. The only one that foams well, consistently, is an
> ultrapasteurized milk that has a refrigerated shelf life on the order of 6
> or 8 weeks. The former "Trim Deluxe," fortified skim milk I'd used, also
> was ultrapasteurized.
>
> I recall reading some other posts here having to do with the superiority
> of UHT milk for frothing; I think that Danny uses this exclusively. UHT
> milk (which has a long shelf life and is stored at room temperature) is of
> course not the same product as what I'm using, but still it is presumably
> exposed to high temperatures for a short period of time in the
> pasteurization process.
>
> My impression now is that there is something to the pasteurization
> process, to ultra pasteurization, that changes the milk in some way and
> makes frothing results better.
>
> Am I on to something?
>
> ken
>




  
Date: 05 Jan 2007 14:53:26
From: Moka Java
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing
I find the ultra pasteurized milk froths better and more consistently
throughout the year. I was also getting a metallic taste from the
regular pasteurized milk available here in the NY Metro area. I've been
using ultra pasteurized milk for several years now. Since I don't drink
much milk other than for cappas the longer shelf life is a plus. The
higher price is more than off-set by what I don't throw out.

R "economical but not cheap" TF

Jack Denver wrote:
> There are 3 kinds of pasteurization - just plain pasteurized (the regular
> milk you buy in the superket with 2 week shelflife), utra (this is
> packaged like the regular and must be kept refrigerated but they use it for
> the higher priced and slower moving "specialty milks - lactose reduced
> (another good foamer), protein fortified, etc. and has a shelf life of a
> couple of months) and UHT (for the room temp brick packs ). Each one is done
> at increasingly high temperatures (for increasing short amounts of time) and
> results in an increasing % of bacteria that are killed (UHT is essentially
> sterilized and not just pasteurized - i.e. 100% of the bacteria are killed
> so there is no possibility of regrowth no matter the storage temp - that is
> why it doesn't require refrigeration before opening - it is essentially a
> modern version of the "canning" process. Pasteurization knocks the
> bacterial counts way down (99+%) but doesn't kill all organisms - it takes a
> while for the colonies to re-multiply in the cold and as long as the counts
> remain relatively low the milk is safe)
>
>
>
> I suspect that pre-cooking the proteins must have a beneficial effect on
> foaming. The UHT tends to have too much of a "cooked" taste so I don't like
> it. The ultras seem to be the best compromise, with taste almost as good as
> regular and better foaming, the one downside being that they seem to cost
> double what regular milk costs.
>
>
>
>
>
> "Ken Fox" <morceaudemerdeThisMerdeGoes@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:507anpF1brnprU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>>Some time back I'd posted about my unexpectedly good results with a
>>protein fortified skim milk I was using in cappas. Over time I found the
>>results to be variable over the course of the year, and what's more, the
>>local grocery stores all stopped carrying it, so I was back to square one.
>>
>>Since then, I've "compromised" on 2% milk for cappas and whole milk for
>>macchiatos (normally I drink one of each every day). But I have found a
>>difference in the frothing quality in the various sorts of 2% milk
>>available to me. The only one that foams well, consistently, is an
>>ultrapasteurized milk that has a refrigerated shelf life on the order of 6
>>or 8 weeks. The former "Trim Deluxe," fortified skim milk I'd used, also
>>was ultrapasteurized.
>>
>>I recall reading some other posts here having to do with the superiority
>>of UHT milk for frothing; I think that Danny uses this exclusively. UHT
>>milk (which has a long shelf life and is stored at room temperature) is of
>>course not the same product as what I'm using, but still it is presumably
>>exposed to high temperatures for a short period of time in the
>>pasteurization process.
>>
>>My impression now is that there is something to the pasteurization
>>process, to ultra pasteurization, that changes the milk in some way and
>>makes frothing results better.
>>
>>Am I on to something?
>>
>>ken
>>
>
>
>


 
Date: 05 Jan 2007 18:17:56
From: Danny
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing
Ken Fox wrote:
> Some time back I'd posted about my unexpectedly good results with a protein
> fortified skim milk I was using in cappas. Over time I found the results to
> be variable over the course of the year, and what's more, the local grocery
> stores all stopped carrying it, so I was back to square one.
>
> Since then, I've "compromised" on 2% milk for cappas and whole milk for
> macchiatos (normally I drink one of each every day). But I have found a
> difference in the frothing quality in the various sorts of 2% milk available
> to me. The only one that foams well, consistently, is an ultrapasteurized
> milk that has a refrigerated shelf life on the order of 6 or 8 weeks. The
> former "Trim Deluxe," fortified skim milk I'd used, also was
> ultrapasteurized.
>
> I recall reading some other posts here having to do with the superiority of
> UHT milk for frothing; I think that Danny uses this exclusively. UHT milk
> (which has a long shelf life and is stored at room temperature) is of course
> not the same product as what I'm using, but still it is presumably exposed
> to high temperatures for a short period of time in the pasteurization
> process.
>
> My impression now is that there is something to the pasteurization process,
> to ultra pasteurization, that changes the milk in some way and makes
> frothing results better.
>
> Am I on to something?
>
> ken
>
>

I don't use UHT milk any longer. I personally preferred the results
(creamier mouthfeel), but it made at least a few people feel sick
after a few coffees. These were all females - I never felt bad after
5 or 6 lattes :) It seemed to induce something akin to morning
sickness in these few regulars, so I reverted to fresh milk, or
actually, Cravendale, which is a "pure filtered" pasteurised milk,
whatever that is. It has a longer shelf life than regular milk, but
has to be kept chilled, but it doesn't suffer from the seasonal
variations that other fresh milk does (often attributed to the cows
difference in diet through the seasons - grass vs silage etc).

UHT was better to work with imho.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/EU ordering for Malabar Gold blend)



 
Date: 05 Jan 2007 09:59:33
From: James Hoffmann
Subject: Re: Ultra Pasteurized Milk Frothing
How is this milk packaged - see through or opaque?

With milk foam obviously we need the whey protein as a surfactant but
for me the other big factor to include is the breakdown of the fat in
milk which results in free glycerol (from the triglycerides) ruining
the foam - usually you hear the bubbles bursting, like a freshly opened
soda, as soon as you finished foaming. This is a bad thing.

Perhaps the pasteurisation affects the speed of the breakdown, though
my big issue with UHT milks is the eggy note caused by the high temps
breaking down some of the amino acids in the whey proteins resulting in
H2S being given off in small quantities.


Ken Fox wrote:

> Some time back I'd posted about my unexpectedly good results with a protein
> fortified skim milk I was using in cappas. Over time I found the results to
> be variable over the course of the year, and what's more, the local grocery
> stores all stopped carrying it, so I was back to square one.
>
> Since then, I've "compromised" on 2% milk for cappas and whole milk for
> macchiatos (normally I drink one of each every day). But I have found a
> difference in the frothing quality in the various sorts of 2% milk available
> to me. The only one that foams well, consistently, is an ultrapasteurized
> milk that has a refrigerated shelf life on the order of 6 or 8 weeks. The
> former "Trim Deluxe," fortified skim milk I'd used, also was
> ultrapasteurized.
>
> I recall reading some other posts here having to do with the superiority of
> UHT milk for frothing; I think that Danny uses this exclusively. UHT milk
> (which has a long shelf life and is stored at room temperature) is of course
> not the same product as what I'm using, but still it is presumably exposed
> to high temperatures for a short period of time in the pasteurization
> process.
>
> My impression now is that there is something to the pasteurization process,
> to ultra pasteurization, that changes the milk in some way and makes
> frothing results better.
>
> Am I on to something?
>
> ken