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Date: 10 Oct 2006 12:24:50
From: Heat + Beans
Subject: Vibiemme or Andreja after Tea?
I might revive and find a new home my now-disassembled Tea that's in a
state of mild decay and possibly worse (read dead in the water). But I
can't worry about that now. I need/want a replacement soon.
Background factors:

Andreja comes from Chris;
http://www.chriscoffee.com/products/home/espresso/andrejapremium
Vibiemme from 1st Line.
http://www.1st-line.com/machines/comm_mod/esprmach/vibiemme/index.htm
Not only is this a draw, it's worse, because it means I won't get
to buy from the other one. I've had very gratifying dealings with
each.

I'm attracted to the Vib's footprint (deeper, lower, a little narrower
than Andreja). I'm intrigued by its substantial weight and draw (62
lbs v. Andreja's 47; 1600 watts v 1400). I like the bigger resevoir
(3.8 to 3.0). On paper, the specs have me leaning here.

I've paid more attention to the Andreja--following it from its
introduction. It seems like a very refined machine, and Chris appears
to have held firm on matters of greatest importance. It's a good idea
that the boiler is insulated since fried connectors and crackled wires
abound in my TEA. OTOH, the Vibiemme has a nice physical arrangement
of boiler and components, and that might address heat buildup; also,
its lower profile will allow more air circulation in its little corner
of the sink.

This Vibiemme model has a shorter track record, but the parent company
is certainly substantial. The most glaring annoyances appear to be
addressed. Short of any hidden glitches, I wouldn't anticipate any
greater problems from either model. Quality of components, IMO, shows
no clear winner. Even so, the Andreja comes out as the more
conservative, or safe, or responsible decision. Hard to ignore that
since I'm much better at worrying than at maintenance.

I am sure that both machines will produce comparably excellent shots
limited only by user skill and error.

Clearly, this is not a "which is better" post. I'd rather have your
musings and questions. What am I missing that's not likely to be
revealed in reviews, specs, and vendors' websites?

Appreciate your thoughts
tin





 
Date: 10 Oct 2006 17:25:39
From: jim schulman
Subject: Re: Vibiemme or Andreja after Tea?
On 10 Oct 2006 12:24:50 -0700, "Heat + Beans" <heatgunroast@gmail.com >
wrote:

>This Vibiemme model has a shorter track record, but the parent company
>is certainly substantial.

It's been around at least 10 years in Europe, under the Domobar
(Zaffiro equivalent) and Domobar Super (Tea equivalent) names. It
shares most components with the commercial VBM line. The reason
Italians like it more is that it uses mostly CMA parts, rather than
Spanish ones. Their version of the E61 head had a reputation for being
less user friendly than the Spanish ones a few years ago, but
recently, the problem, whatever it was, has been solved.

Quickmill has a very long record in relaible home machines, since
their first, rotary based models go back to the late 60s, and still
show up on ebay. They have a general reputation in Europe of building
tanks. However, their career in E61 boxes is relatively short.


 
Date: 10 Oct 2006 20:42:20
From: I->Ian
Subject: Re: Vibiemme or Andreja after Tea?
On 10 Oct 2006 12:24:50 -0700, "Heat + Beans" <heatgunroast@gmail.com >
wrote:

>I might revive and find a new home my now-disassembled Tea that's in a
>state of mild decay and possibly worse (read dead in the water). But I
>can't worry about that now. I need/want a replacement soon.
>Background factors:
>
>Andreja comes from Chris;
>http://www.chriscoffee.com/products/home/espresso/andrejapremium
>Vibiemme from 1st Line.
>http://www.1st-line.com/machines/comm_mod/esprmach/vibiemme/index.htm
> Not only is this a draw, it's worse, because it means I won't get
>to buy from the other one. I've had very gratifying dealings with
>each.
>
>I'm attracted to the Vib's footprint (deeper, lower, a little narrower
>than Andreja). I'm intrigued by its substantial weight and draw (62
>lbs v. Andreja's 47; 1600 watts v 1400). I like the bigger resevoir
>(3.8 to 3.0). On paper, the specs have me leaning here.
>
>I've paid more attention to the Andreja--following it from its
>introduction. It seems like a very refined machine, and Chris appears
>to have held firm on matters of greatest importance. It's a good idea
>that the boiler is insulated since fried connectors and crackled wires
>abound in my TEA. OTOH, the Vibiemme has a nice physical arrangement
>of boiler and components, and that might address heat buildup; also,
>its lower profile will allow more air circulation in its little corner
>of the sink.
>
>This Vibiemme model has a shorter track record, but the parent company
>is certainly substantial. The most glaring annoyances appear to be
>addressed. Short of any hidden glitches, I wouldn't anticipate any
>greater problems from either model. Quality of components, IMO, shows
>no clear winner. Even so, the Andreja comes out as the more
>conservative, or safe, or responsible decision. Hard to ignore that
>since I'm much better at worrying than at maintenance.
>
>I am sure that both machines will produce comparably excellent shots
>limited only by user skill and error.
>
>Clearly, this is not a "which is better" post. I'd rather have your
>musings and questions. What am I missing that's not likely to be
>revealed in reviews, specs, and vendors' websites?
>
>Appreciate your thoughts
>tin

I spent several months rating chrome e61HX boxes and came to the same
two finalists. I purchased the Vibiemme from
http://www.espressocare.com after a discussion with Stefano who
definintely knows his way around an e61. Others, Italians mostly, have
said I made the right choice.

See topic E61 Comparison Chart for further comments.
http://www.coffeegeek.com/forums/espresso/machines/256594

Other than a water depth that was too low, the machine has been
flawless and it beautifully constructed.
http://www.espressocare.com/InsideVBM.htm

I did replace the shower screen as the original was slightly skewed,
but I may have done that while cleaning.
http://www.puly-usa.com/commerce/product_info.php?cPath=925_926&products_id=15562