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Date: 29 Nov 2006 18:58:01
From: Lloyd Parsons
Subject: Cafe cremas
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In another thread, this was discussed.
I had been using a double dose and pulling 6 oz in 40-45 seconds. From
recommendations, I played around with grind and tamp a bit and now get 6
oz in 25 seconds.
Better taste and smoother.
On another note. I contacted chriscoffee.com and 1st-line.com and got a
bit of divergent recommendations.
Chriscoffee recommended a machine or two and 1st-line said that given
what I want to do to just save my money. I sure wasn't expecting that
last advice.
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Date: 29 Nov 2006 21:31:57
From: Heat + Beans
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>
> So when I read here and in other places from the espresso lovers that
> think that if you don't like espresso, you can't possible be a coffee
> lover, I just figure that is their particular snobbishness showing.
Actually, I don't come across many posts of this sort. I think that
Marshall's view is pretty representative----firm, but not at all
judgemental.
In most American cities there is a handful (if you are lucky) of shops
that consistently produce brilliant espresso. Better odds in Italy,
but not foolproof. IMO, best place to find excellent espresso is in
your own kitchen or that of another geek. Get the best machine you can
afford, and you just might win yourself over to ristrettos. If not,
you might decide that the noble 2:1 or 3:1 Americano is a shade
preferable to you cafe cremas.
And if not, there's a lot to be said for a major hunk of stainless
steel to produce the drink you want.
Martin
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 10:01:37
From: Lloyd Parsons
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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In article <1164864717.545013.326220@h54g2000cwb.googlegroups.com >,
"Heat + Beans" <heatgunroast@gmail.com > wrote:
> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> >
> > So when I read here and in other places from the espresso lovers that
> > think that if you don't like espresso, you can't possible be a coffee
> > lover, I just figure that is their particular snobbishness showing.
> Actually, I don't come across many posts of this sort. I think that
> Marshall's view is pretty representative----firm, but not at all
> judgemental.
>
> In most American cities there is a handful (if you are lucky) of shops
> that consistently produce brilliant espresso. Better odds in Italy,
> but not foolproof. IMO, best place to find excellent espresso is in
> your own kitchen or that of another geek. Get the best machine you can
> afford, and you just might win yourself over to ristrettos. If not,
> you might decide that the noble 2:1 or 3:1 Americano is a shade
> preferable to you cafe cremas.
>
> And if not, there's a lot to be said for a major hunk of stainless
> steel to produce the drink you want.
>
> Martin
I'm 62 and started drinking, or at least trying espresso, in Italy about
30 years ago. Since then I've tried it in various places but just never
acquired the taste.
I like Americanos, but I like the cafe cremas better. Just personal
preference.
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 01:46:13
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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On Wed, 29 Nov 2006 18:58:01 -0600, Lloyd Parsons
<lloydparsons@mac.com > wrote:
>In another thread, this was discussed.
>
>I had been using a double dose and pulling 6 oz in 40-45 seconds. From
>recommendations, I played around with grind and tamp a bit and now get 6
>oz in 25 seconds.
>
>Better taste and smoother.
>
>On another note. I contacted chriscoffee.com and 1st-line.com and got a
>bit of divergent recommendations.
>
>Chriscoffee recommended a machine or two and 1st-line said that given
>what I want to do to just save my money. I sure wasn't expecting that
>last advice.
Most espresso fans think cafe crema is just a badly made espresso, and
that third-rate equipment will make it as well (or as badly) as great
equipment. People often recommend a Senseo or superautomatic for cafe
cremas.
I would probably agree with this opinion, except that your drink is
also the favorite brew of a couple of people I respect a lot (Ted
Simpson and HV). So, don't be surprised at the brush-off, but it's no
reason for you to stop enjoying them.
Marshall
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 03:14:18
From: Coffee for Connoisseurs
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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>Most espresso fans think cafe crema is just a badly made espresso, and
>that third-rate equipment will make it as well (or as badly) as great
>equipment.
Most espresso fans would be wrong. You need a stable enough water
temperature and sufficient water debit for good extraction. I find Cafe
Cremas an interesting and reproducable cupping tool for evaluating the
suitabilty of coffees for espresso.
--
Alan
alanfrew@coffeeco.com.au
www.coffeeco.com.au
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Date: 29 Nov 2006 22:06:34
From: Lloyd Parsons
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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In article <e0sbh.36$HU.20@news-server.bigpond.net.au >,
"Coffee for Connoisseurs" <alanfrew@coffeeco.com.au > wrote:
> >Most espresso fans think cafe crema is just a badly made espresso, and
> >that third-rate equipment will make it as well (or as badly) as great
> >equipment.
>
> Most espresso fans would be wrong. You need a stable enough water
> temperature and sufficient water debit for good extraction. I find Cafe
> Cremas an interesting and reproducable cupping tool for evaluating the
> suitabilty of coffees for espresso.
Aha! I wouldn't have thought of that use.
So if I were to say move to an HX, E61 type machine (Anita or Tea II),
would that be heat stable enough for a 6 oz pull?
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 06:18:08
From: Coffee for Connoisseurs
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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>So if I were to say move to an HX,
>E61 type machine (Anita or Tea II),
>would that be heat stable enough
>for a 6 oz pull?
Yep. Minimum requirement in my experience is 300ml boiler, anything bigger
is better. E61 better some more.
--
Alan
alanfrew@coffeeco.com.au
www.coffeeco.com.au
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Date: 29 Nov 2006 20:45:43
From: Lloyd Parsons
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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In article <amdsm2lcm4o3mi5rrfsje2ldhi04tgbdp8@4ax.com >,
Marshall <mrfuss@ihatespamearthlink.net > wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Nov 2006 18:58:01 -0600, Lloyd Parsons
> <lloydparsons@mac.com> wrote:
>
> >In another thread, this was discussed.
> >
> >I had been using a double dose and pulling 6 oz in 40-45 seconds. From
> >recommendations, I played around with grind and tamp a bit and now get 6
> >oz in 25 seconds.
> >
> >Better taste and smoother.
> >
> >On another note. I contacted chriscoffee.com and 1st-line.com and got a
> >bit of divergent recommendations.
> >
> >Chriscoffee recommended a machine or two and 1st-line said that given
> >what I want to do to just save my money. I sure wasn't expecting that
> >last advice.
>
> Most espresso fans think cafe crema is just a badly made espresso, and
> that third-rate equipment will make it as well (or as badly) as great
> equipment. People often recommend a Senseo or superautomatic for cafe
> cremas.
>
> I would probably agree with this opinion, except that your drink is
> also the favorite brew of a couple of people I respect a lot (Ted
> Simpson and HV). So, don't be surprised at the brush-off, but it's no
> reason for you to stop enjoying them.
>
> Marshall
Thanks. I don't let others determine what I like or don't like, or at
least it isn't the only reason.
I think that there are a bunch of coffee lovers that don't do espresso
at all, in fact I know it to be a fact. Others like the single-serves,
I use them myself for that first cup that I need RIGHT NOW!
So when I read here and in other places from the espresso lovers that
think that if you don't like espresso, you can't possible be a coffee
lover, I just figure that is their particular snobbishness showing. We
all have that, just about different things.
I have drank straight espresso, but never really liked it. Regardless
of where I got it, or what bean or roast was involved, it always tastes
way too bitter for me to notice anything about it. When I was in Italy,
I usually got a shot of cognac and poured it into the espresso to cut it
a bit. And I noticed that I wasn't the only one, nor were the others
Americans either. Lots of Italians I met did the same thing.
Cafe cremas fill the bill for me. Bold enough to grab your taste buds,
but full of all the nuance the espresso people all talk about. For
those that haven't tried them, give 'em a go. You might find them
delightful, or at least another brew to add to your list of brews.
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 16:41:57
From: Harry Moos
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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Pardon my ignorance, but what is a Cafe Crema?
"Lloyd Parsons" <lloydparsons@mac.com > wrote in message
news:lloydparsons-22EE88.18580129112006@individual.net...
> In another thread, this was discussed.
>
> I had been using a double dose and pulling 6 oz in 40-45 seconds. From
> recommendations, I played around with grind and tamp a bit and now get 6
> oz in 25 seconds.
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 16:52:06
From: Lloyd Parsons
Subject: Re: Cafe cremas
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In article <fv-dneS-pI6yw_LYnZ2dnUVZ_t2dnZ2d@news.ruraltel.net >,
"Harry Moos" <harrym@ruraltel.net > wrote:
> Pardon my ignorance, but what is a Cafe Crema?
>
> "Lloyd Parsons" <lloydparsons@mac.com> wrote in message
> news:lloydparsons-22EE88.18580129112006@individual.net...
> > In another thread, this was discussed.
> >
> > I had been using a double dose and pulling 6 oz in 40-45 seconds. From
> > recommendations, I played around with grind and tamp a bit and now get 6
> > oz in 25 seconds.
It is just a different way of using an espresso machine.
You use a double-dose of grounds, ground coarser than espresso grind (
3-notches coarser on my MDF), lighter tamp and pull a 6 oz cup through
the portafilter.
Very bold and full flavored, with a better mouthfeel (IMO) than an
Americano.
Hope that helps.
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