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Date: 04 Sep 2006 14:50:24
From: swinches
Subject: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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Hello All,
Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
"Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
(parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
(schematics) would be much appreciated..
Thank you in advance,
swinches
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 00:12:30
From: Steve Ackman
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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In <1157406624.348783.127070@74g2000cwt.googlegroups.com >, on 4 Sep 2006
14:50:24 -0700, swinches wrote:
> Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
> "Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
> have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
> (parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
> (schematics) would be much appreciated..
L1 -- N -- L2
L1 is hot. N is grounded neutral. L2 is hot.
L1 to N = 120 VAC
N to L2 = 120 VAC
L1 to L2 = 240 VAC
Some of the outlets in your kitchen will likely
be of the L1 to N variety and others will likely
be of the L2 to N type.
What you're thinking of doing is finding an outlet
with L1 and and outlet with L2 and running the "hots"
from each to the machine. Electrically, it's the same
as if you're running off a 240v circuit EXCEPT that a
240v circuit breaker has L1 and L2 physically tied
together. If one side trips, the breaker opens both
hot legs.
In the make-240-from-120's method, you have two
separate breakers which aren't physically tied together,
so one side can trip leaving the other live.
Yes, it's *possible* to run a 240v machine off two
120's "added" in such a manner, but certainly not
advisable.
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 19:25:36
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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"swinches" <swinches@cox.net > wrote in message
news:1157406624.348783.127070@74g2000cwt.googlegroups.com...
> Hello All,
>
> Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
> "Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
> have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
> (parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
> (schematics) would be much appreciated..
>
> Thank you in advance,
>
> swinches
>
Hopefully I am understanding your post the way you intended it, rather than
as many will read it.
What I think you want to do is to take 110v current in your house and turn
it into 220v current, to operate this machine with, as opposed to "rewiring"
the machine itself to run off of 110v. If that isn't what you meant then I
hope you would rethink what you want.
Although I am sure that you COULD rewire the espresso machine to run off of
110v., you are very likely not to like the results and it is likely to cost
you more in replacement parts and aggravation than it is worth.
If what you want to do is to figure out how to get 220v to the machine then
if you have two 110v circuits I think you can make 220v out of it if I
believe what I have seen posted here before, by people who understand this
stuff, which I do not. On the other hand, barring some sort of rental
housing that you can't tinker with, almost certainly you can get a 220v line
to the espresso machine, done by an electrician, that will cost less than
modifying the machine itself.
ken
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 01:51:08
From: Marshall
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 19:25:36 -0600, "Ken Fox"
<morceaudemerdeThisMerdeGoes@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On the other hand, barring some sort of rental
>housing that you can't tinker with, almost certainly you can get a 220v line
>to the espresso machine, done by an electrician, that will cost less than
>modifying the machine itself.
>
>ken
It depends on how far away the breaker box is from the machine and
whether your electrician has to punch holes in your walls and ceilings
to run a new conduit (quite a few in our case for our new wall oven).
Marshall "the kitchen still looks like a tsunami hit it"
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 19:58:41
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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"Marshall" <mrfuss@ihatespamearthlink.net > wrote in message
news:hllpf25qrageuts00ai65mfrer0drcf8pn@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 19:25:36 -0600, "Ken Fox"
> <morceaudemerdeThisMerdeGoes@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On the other hand, barring some sort of rental
>>housing that you can't tinker with, almost certainly you can get a 220v
>>line
>>to the espresso machine, done by an electrician, that will cost less than
>>modifying the machine itself.
>>
>>ken
>
> It depends on how far away the breaker box is from the machine and
> whether your electrician has to punch holes in your walls and ceilings
> to run a new conduit (quite a few in our case for our new wall oven).
>
> Marshall "the kitchen still looks like a tsunami hit it"
I said "almost" certainly. People who live in multifamily dwellings may
have fewer options depending on the CC&Rs and local building codes. In a
detached house you could, presumably, put a new line in conduit, run it
outside then back inside through an outside wall. Even if this cost $500 it
would probably be cheaper than modifying the espresso machine. Depending on
where the machine will go, it might be possible to steal power from the
circuit used by the oven, if electric. There are all sorts of options and
not all will work in any house and there may be the odd dwelling where
nothing will work.
But I do think that for most situations it would be cheaper to bring the
power to the machine than to convert the machine. Alternatively, one could
always sell the machine and buy one with the right voltage for where one
intends to use it.
ken
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 15:09:00
From: Brent
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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Use an extension cord...
:)
>>> On the other hand, barring some sort of rental
>>>housing that you can't tinker with, almost certainly you can get a 220v
>>>line
>>>to the espresso machine, done by an electrician, that will cost less than
>>>modifying the machine itself.
>>>
>>>ken
>>
>> It depends on how far away the breaker box is from the machine and
>> whether your electrician has to punch holes in your walls and ceilings
>> to run a new conduit (quite a few in our case for our new wall oven).
>>
>> Marshall "the kitchen still looks like a tsunami hit it"
>
> I said "almost" certainly. People who live in multifamily dwellings may
> have fewer options depending on the CC&Rs and local building codes. In a
> detached house you could, presumably, put a new line in conduit, run it
> outside then back inside through an outside wall. Even if this cost $500
> it would probably be cheaper than modifying the espresso machine.
> Depending on where the machine will go, it might be possible to steal
> power from the circuit used by the oven, if electric. There are all sorts
> of options and not all will work in any house and there may be the odd
> dwelling where nothing will work.
>
> But I do think that for most situations it would be cheaper to bring the
> power to the machine than to convert the machine. Alternatively, one
> could always sell the machine and buy one with the right voltage for where
> one intends to use it.
>
> ken
>
>
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 06:11:17
From: daveb
Subject: Re: La Cimbali 220V>110V wiring conversion -- NOT!!
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MORE $$$$ than it is worth!!
dave
www.hitechespresso.com
swinches wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
> "Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
> have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
> (parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
> (schematics) would be much appreciated..
>
> Thank you in advance,
>
> swinches
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 15:31:39
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: La Cimbali 220V>110V wiring conversion -- NOT!!
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How much money could 10' - 20' of 14 ga wire cost? Provided there are two
wall outlets available that are on discrete circuits there should be no
problem cobbling together an extension cord for 120 to 240 conversion.
Lacking the availability of two discrete 120 volt circuits the only options
would be to have a QUALIFIED electrician add a 240 volt circuit to a new
wall plug (It cost me $250 for three new outlets on one 25 amp circuit.) or
rewire the machine for 120 volt (THIS is an expensive option, as my
neighbor is learning.). And it's worth is whatever value you place on it. I
often tackle projects that I know will run into the red just because they
interest me.
"daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com > wrote in news:1157461877.862319.69660
@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com:
> MORE $$$$ than it is worth!!
>
> dave
> www.hitechespresso.com
>
>
> swinches wrote:
>> Hello All,
>>
>> Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
>> "Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
>> have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
>> (parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
>> (schematics) would be much appreciated..
>>
>> Thank you in advance,
>>
>> swinches
>
>
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 05:18:28
From: Omniryx@gmail.com
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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He missed the "certainly not advisable" part, Steve.
Will
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 00:10:36
From: swinches
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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Steve Ackman wrote:
> In <1157406624.348783.127070@74g2000cwt.googlegroups.com>, on 4 Sep 2006
> 14:50:24 -0700, swinches wrote:
>
> > Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
> > "Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
> > have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
> > (parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
> > (schematics) would be much appreciated..
>
>
> L1 -- N -- L2
>
> L1 is hot. N is grounded neutral. L2 is hot.
>
> L1 to N = 120 VAC
> N to L2 = 120 VAC
> L1 to L2 = 240 VAC
>
> Some of the outlets in your kitchen will likely
> be of the L1 to N variety and others will likely
> be of the L2 to N type.
>
> What you're thinking of doing is finding an outlet
> with L1 and and outlet with L2 and running the "hots"
> from each to the machine. Electrically, it's the same
> as if you're running off a 240v circuit EXCEPT that a
> 240v circuit breaker has L1 and L2 physically tied
> together. If one side trips, the breaker opens both
> hot legs.
>
> In the make-240-from-120's method, you have two
> separate breakers which aren't physically tied together,
> so one side can trip leaving the other live.
>
> Yes, it's *possible* to run a 240v machine off two
> 120's "added" in such a manner, but certainly not
> advisable.
Thank you Steve, as well as everyone else..
This was the information I was looking for :)
..I will attempt the L1 to L2 = 240 VAC method.
Best regards,
swinches
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 18:28:56
From:
Subject: Re: La Cimbali M32 Bistro 2 220V>110V wiring conversion
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swinches wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> Can anyone tell me how one would convert (rewire) a La Cimbali M32
> "Bistro 2" espresso machine from 220VAC to operate off of 110VAC? I
> have heard that the machine can be rewired to use two 110VAC plugs
> (parallel?) wiring... Any feedback and/or technical documents
> (schematics) would be much appreciated..
>
> Thank you in advance,
>
> swinches
My suggestion is hire an electrican to run a 220 circuit from your
breaker panel. If you use 110 v circuits of L1 & L2 you would be
setting yourself up for a very DANGEROUS and possibly DEADLY
environment. I spent 30 years in the field and like Steve and Will said
it can be done but is not ADVISABLE.
Alot like Jurassak (sp) Park the mud splatered jeep at the end read
"YOUR ASS PARK"
if you look close.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 16:39:08
From: daveb
Subject: Re: La Cimbali 220V>110V wiring conversion -- NOT!!
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Robert Harmon wrote:
> How much money could 10' - 20' of 14 ga wire cost?
oh about $5.00, Bob. why don't YOU go over there and make it WORK for
him.
everythin' must be simpler in Texas.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 23:57:26
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: La Cimbali 220V>110V wiring conversion -- NOT!!
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Well, it aint brain surgery is it Dave?
But it is not something someone should attempt without a working knowledge
of electricity or a good book with clear diagrams. Hell, it's not even that
big a job to add a new 240 volt circuit to your existing fuse panel. Either
use two empty slots or add a small box to the main fuse box. The hard part
is running the line through the walls & it's OK to use conduit if the
machine sits next to an exterior wall.
It's almost as simple as adding a PID to a Silvia isn't it Dave?
--
Robert (K.I.S.S.!) Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r
"daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1157499548.745992.29610@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>
> Robert Harmon wrote:
>> How much money could 10' - 20' of 14 ga wire cost?
>
> oh about $5.00, Bob. why don't YOU go over there and make it WORK for
> him.
>
> everythin' must be simpler in Texas.
>
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 18:45:41
From: daveb
Subject: 220V>110V wiring conversion advice -- not
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so don't advise him!!
duh!
Dave
Steve Ackman wrote:
> Yes, it's *possible* to run a 240v machine off two
> 120's "added" in such a manner, but certainly not
> advisable.
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 18:43:44
From: daveb
Subject: Re: La Cimbali 220V>110V wiring conversion = bad idea
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how's yer ebay sales, harmon?
pearland_*??
d
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Date: 07 Sep 2006 02:14:34
From: Robert Harmon
Subject: Re: La Cimbali 220V>110V wiring conversion = bad idea
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howdy pard, how they hangin?
kinda slow just now. that's a good thing as it gives me more time to fish.
friends have reported some medium tuna & big wahoo/mahi to be had off shore.
it's been a good summer so far; got two neighbors hooked into the coffee
habit, learned a few things about deep water navigating, saw my daughter
graduate college, saw my son land a huge contract with the aerospace
industry, & nasa awarded the moon/mars orion contract (we're back in the
space exploration business!)
my espresso machine hobby has been taking too much of my time. as you know
i've been buying machines cheaply on ebay, refurbing them, and selling them
on ebay or to my friends. there's no challenge to this so i'll probably
close the book on this activity, except for friends & neighbors with special
requests. i had a big project under way with rewiring a nuova simonelli
personal but thankfully i was able to convince my neighbor that adding a 240
volt circuit in his kitchen made more long-term sense.
i'm still doing design work on the espresso machine i am developing. we're
currently looking at a piston brew system based on a desmodromic cam timing
operation to control the process. we've got some pretty talented people
doing the prototyping now & if all goes well we should have some beta models
ready by next june.
my coffee collection has reached the point where the ol' ball & chain
suggested an addition to the house for use as a gallery. i must have built
up some gold plated karma to deserve a gal like her. as they say, "third
time's a charm."
--
Robert (never take offense at what a half wit thinks of you) Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/pou2y
http://tinyurl.com/fkd6r
"daveb" <davebobblane@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1157593419.346782.7240@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
> how's yer ebay sales, harmon?
>
> pearland_*??
>
> d
>
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