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Date: 03 May 2007 11:06:15
From: Danny
Subject: coffee in France & adventure
1st: Coffee in France is still awful. Most can't even make a cappa,
which is what Lucy likes - some put aerosol cream on top, one put
chocolate in it, some made an americano with some steamed milk on top...

Lucy made me go to a Starbucks in Paris (pic to follow!) She wanted to
try the awful caramel latte thingie. The staff seemed all to be new
that day - the guy on the counter added up the bill wrong (2 coffees
and two croissant), in my favour, and the guy on the superauto seemed
to at least half fill the cup with syrup before deciding he had
enough. Result was undrinkable, and I have a sweet tooth.

Had pleasant weekend in Paris, even got up the Eiffel Tower for once,
and did the Seine boat cruise.

Not so much fun coming back - hit a black line (actually a really
sharp lump of motorway) on the A13 after a peage pay point, which
wrecked both wheels on the Blackbird, followed by man with recovery
lorry failing to secure bike correctly so it fell over on the way to
the garage. Bike still in garage in Vernon, where we waited for two
days for a wheel that never came. We negotiated trains to ferry and
I've now bought a wheel to take back to France after their two bank
holidays.....


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)





 
Date: 04 May 2007 22:28:36
From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=E9r=E9my?= JUST
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Le Thu, 3 May 2007 18:52:12 +0100,
"Ken Wilson" <ken@kwilsonDEDUCT.fsnet.co.uk > a écrit :

> Have all those nice neighbourhood roasters in each paris
> arrondissement gone?

Of course not! I still buy my coffee in one of these small shops.


> Espresso was french style

In fact, when you order a coffee in Paris (and in most big cities),
you'll be served an espresso (an « express », a « noir »...).

If you want something else (eg coffee with milk), the bartender will
have to improvise.


Danny, what did you dislike in French coffee? Did you really try
espresso?
BTW, why have you been into a Starbucks to buy croissants? Any baker
has some fresher ones (I've heard that some Starbucks shops just buy
them each morning to the nearest baker and sell them during the day).


--
Jérémy JUST <jeremy_just@netcourrier.com >


  
Date: 05 May 2007 09:10:52
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Jérémy JUST wrote:
> Le Thu, 3 May 2007 18:52:12 +0100,
> "Ken Wilson" <ken@kwilsonDEDUCT.fsnet.co.uk> a écrit :
>
>
>>Have all those nice neighbourhood roasters in each paris
>>arrondissement gone?
>
>
> Of course not! I still buy my coffee in one of these small shops.
>
>
>
>>Espresso was french style
>
>
> In fact, when you order a coffee in Paris (and in most big cities),
> you'll be served an espresso (an « express », a « noir »...).
>
> If you want something else (eg coffee with milk), the bartender will
> have to improvise.
>
>
> Danny, what did you dislike in French coffee? Did you really try
> espresso?
> BTW, why have you been into a Starbucks to buy croissants? Any baker
> has some fresher ones (I've heard that some Starbucks shops just buy
> them each morning to the nearest baker and sell them during the day).
>
>

Most cafes buy croissants from the baker and re-sell them, or most
that we used did, anyway. I do it myself in my espresso bar.

OK, anybody that has known me for any length of time will know that I
would never willingly sit in a *$, nor buy a croissant from one
either, but since we had sat in the small bar/tabacs many times,
enjoying baked goods from the local patisserie, I indulged Lucy in her
desire for a whipped cream & vanilla confection. I found the whole
experience a joke, and viewed it as such, not understanding why people
would eschew the local cafes in Paris for the *$ experience, other
than those that wanted the iced drinks.

I am perfectly aware what an espresso is (see my site below). MOst of
the espresso I witnessed in Paris bore no resemblence to the product I
sell in my espresso bar - fast blonde pours using pf's left cold on
the side seemed to be the norm. That isn't espresso in anything other
than name, and I wasn't inclined to drink it straight. I have visited
Paris many times, and preferred the old days of cafe-au-lait with
scalded milk and a croissant to dunk.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



 
Date: 03 May 2007 18:14:15
From: bernie
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Danny wrote:

> 1st: Coffee in France is still awful. Most can't even make a cappa,
> which is what Lucy likes - some put aerosol cream on top, one put
> chocolate in it, some made an americano with some steamed milk on top...
>
> Lucy made me go to a Starbucks in Paris (pic to follow!) She wanted to
> try the awful caramel latte thingie. The staff seemed all to be new
> that day - the guy on the counter added up the bill wrong (2 coffees and
> two croissant), in my favour, and the guy on the superauto seemed to at
> least half fill the cup with syrup before deciding he had enough.
> Result was undrinkable, and I have a sweet tooth.
>
> Had pleasant weekend in Paris, even got up the Eiffel Tower for once,
> and did the Seine boat cruise.
>
> Not so much fun coming back - hit a black line (actually a really sharp
> lump of motorway) on the A13 after a peage pay point, which wrecked both
> wheels on the Blackbird, followed by man with recovery lorry failing to
> secure bike correctly so it fell over on the way to the garage. Bike
> still in garage in Vernon, where we waited for two days for a wheel that
> never came. We negotiated trains to ferry and I've now bought a wheel
> to take back to France after their two bank holidays.....
>
>

I'm envious. Been thirty years since we lived in Europe. How's
this-I'll drive 7 hours at 70+mph and still be in the same state. I can
remember when a seven hour drive would put you through at least one and
a half countries.
Bernie


  
Date: 06 May 2007 09:04:48
From: pltrgyst
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 03 May 2007 18:14:15 -0600, bernie <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote:

> I'm envious. Been thirty years since we lived in Europe. How's
>this-I'll drive 7 hours at 70+mph and still be in the same state.....

Assuming you mean without leaving that state, this could only be done
with a carefully-chosen starting point and direction in Alaska,
California, and Texas.

And I could do the same thing in France.

-- Larry



   
Date: 07 May 2007 11:22:48
From: bernie
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
pltrgyst wrote:
> On Thu, 03 May 2007 18:14:15 -0600, bernie <bdigman@zianet.com> wrote:
>
>
>> I'm envious. Been thirty years since we lived in Europe. How's
>>this-I'll drive 7 hours at 70+mph and still be in the same state.....
>
>
> Assuming you mean without leaving that state, this could only be done
> with a carefully-chosen starting point and direction in Alaska,
> California, and Texas.
>
> And I could do the same thing in France.
>
> -- Larry
>

Use MapQuest and put in the trip from Shiprock, New Mexico to
Carlsbad. It is 504miles. At 70mph that comes out to a little over 7 hours.
Bernie


    
Date: 07 May 2007 21:28:14
From: D. Ross
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
bernie <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote:



  
Date: 06 May 2007 07:18:11
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
bernie wrote:

> I'm envious. Been thirty years since we lived in Europe. How's
> this-I'll drive 7 hours at 70+mph and still be in the same state. I can
> remember when a seven hour drive would put you through at least one and
> a half countries.
> Bernie

Doesn't matter which direction you do it in, a 70mph 7 hour drive
would definitely get you out of this country :) Unfortunately, it's a
7 hour ferry crossing from here, and Lucy gets sick every time.


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



   
Date: 06 May 2007 08:36:21
From: Bill (Adopt)
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
In article <5a5aa4F2n3eirU1@mid.individual.net >,
Danny <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote:
> bernie wrote:

> > I'm envious. Been thirty years since we lived in Europe. How's
> > this-I'll drive 7 hours at 70+mph and still be in the same state. I can
> > remember when a seven hour drive would put you through at least one and
> > a half countries.
> > Bernie

> Doesn't matter which direction you do it in, a 70mph 7 hour drive
> would definitely get you out of this country :) Unfortunately, it's a
> 7 hour ferry crossing from here, and Lucy gets sick every time.

..oh, that's a real pity. :((

Is Lucy sensitive to travel sickness pills - with some they
only seems to make matters worse. At least she shares this
malaise with many historically famous people, Admiral Lord
Nelson, for one..

So no overnighters as footpassengers on the ferries? No
spending the next day doing the tourist bit picking up
family shopping and other goodies at the Calais markets,
or hopping up the coast to Ostende, Brugge - even, a quick
stop en route in Blankenburge.

Perhaps he's still there, but there used to be a very, very
'large' gentleman who owned a cafe in Blankenburg. I think
he might have been originally from Liverpool, GB. He always
seemed to us, docking at 05h30 or so in Zeebrugge and getting
the first tram of the day along to Blankenburge, that he was
the only place ever open.

He did the most superbly delicious coffee, with a bounce, a
flair, an expertise that would delight any Altie, especially
one bleary-eyed in the cool early morning mists.. :))

Reason for rambling, Danny, is that when I imagine you in
your centre of Portsmouth tented emporium, I somehow think
of this gentle and welcoming Blankenburge cafe proprietor.
It must be the thought of the always memorable coffee.. :))

Bill ZFC

--
Adoption InterLink UK with -=- http://www.billsimpson.com/
Domain Host Orpheus Internet -=- http://www.orpheusinternet.co.uk/


    
Date: 06 May 2007 16:04:22
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Bill (Adopt) wrote:

> ..oh, that's a real pity. :((
>
> Is Lucy sensitive to travel sickness pills - with some they
> only seems to make matters worse. At least she shares this
> malaise with many historically famous people, Admiral Lord
> Nelson, for one..
>
> So no overnighters as footpassengers on the ferries? No
> spending the next day doing the tourist bit picking up
> family shopping and other goodies at the Calais markets,
> or hopping up the coast to Ostende, Brugge - even, a quick
> stop en route in Blankenburge.
>
> Perhaps he's still there, but there used to be a very, very
> 'large' gentleman who owned a cafe in Blankenburg. I think
> he might have been originally from Liverpool, GB. He always
> seemed to us, docking at 05h30 or so in Zeebrugge and getting
> the first tram of the day along to Blankenburge, that he was
> the only place ever open.
>
> He did the most superbly delicious coffee, with a bounce, a
> flair, an expertise that would delight any Altie, especially
> one bleary-eyed in the cool early morning mists.. :))
>
> Reason for rambling, Danny, is that when I imagine you in
> your centre of Portsmouth tented emporium, I somehow think
> of this gentle and welcoming Blankenburge cafe proprietor.
> It must be the thought of the always memorable coffee.. :))
>
> Bill ZFC
>

Lucy loves being in France, just doesn't like getting there. The only
partial fix we've found is expensive - go overnight and book a cabin.
If she can sleep she's OK. We've tried the sickness pills they give
out on Brittany ferries, to no avail. P&O used to sell some spanish
tablets in a pink box on their Bilbao crossing - these worked great
for me in a force 9 across the Bay of Biscay, but I don't know what
they were called.

We have a friendly bar in Honfleur we visit - the owner is a middle
aged chap, like me, who runs the place in a haphazard way, but with a
friendly smile and a cigarette in the ash tray on the bar, like me :)

Coffee isn't great, though, but the ambience makes up for it.

Got a wheel for the Blackbird now, so it's off to Vernon again next
week to get the bike fixed and back to England....



--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



     
Date: 07 May 2007 11:13:43
From: bernie
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Danny wrote:
>> Bill ZFC
>>
>
> Lucy loves being in France, just doesn't like getting there. The only
> partial fix we've found is expensive - go overnight and book a cabin.
> If she can sleep she's OK. We've tried the sickness pills they give
> out on Brittany ferries, to no avail. P&O used to sell some spanish
> tablets in a pink box on their Bilbao crossing - these worked great for
> me in a force 9 across the Bay of Biscay, but I don't know what they
> were called.
>
> We have a friendly bar in Honfleur we visit - the owner is a middle aged
> chap, like me, who runs the place in a haphazard way, but with a
> friendly smile and a cigarette in the ash tray on the bar, like me :)
>
> Coffee isn't great, though, but the ambience makes up for it.
>
> Got a wheel for the Blackbird now, so it's off to Vernon again next week
> to get the bike fixed and back to England....
>
>
>

Danny,

My wife and sister can also get sick easily on voyages or even
short whale-watching trips. Several months ago we were in Hawaii and the
whale watching aficiandos suggested dried/candied ginger. It seemed to
work for me, although I think I took a bit too much because it was
sweet. You might try this remedy.
Bernie




      
Date: 07 May 2007 20:20:17
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
bernie wrote:

> Danny,
>
> My wife and sister can also get sick easily on voyages or even
> short whale-watching trips. Several months ago we were in Hawaii and the
> whale watching aficiandos suggested dried/candied ginger. It seemed to
> work for me, although I think I took a bit too much because it was
> sweet. You might try this remedy.
> Bernie
>
>

I've heard about ginger before. Lucy doesn't like ginger, but I
certainly think it's worth a try. Apparently it doesn't matter what
form the ginger takes...


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



  
Date: 05 May 2007 19:54:05
From: Sheldon T. Hall - DO NOT MAIL
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 03 May 2007 18:14:15 -0600, bernie <bdigman@zianet.com > wrote:

>
> I'm envious. Been thirty years since we lived in Europe. How's
>this-I'll drive 7 hours at 70+mph and still be in the same state. I can
>remember when a seven hour drive would put you through at least one and
>a half countries.

In some places in Yurp, if you fall over, your head's in another
country.

-Shel



 
Date: 03 May 2007 11:13:42
From: I->Ian
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 03 May 2007 11:06:15 +0100, Danny
<danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote:

>1st: Coffee in France is still awful.

1 - Paris is not France

2 - Hang out in Cannes or Nice with Italians and you can find great
coffee.


  
Date: 03 May 2007 19:27:33
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
I- >Ian wrote:
> On Thu, 03 May 2007 11:06:15 +0100, Danny
> <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com> wrote:
>
>
>>1st: Coffee in France is still awful.
>
>
> 1 - Paris is not France
>
> 2 - Hang out in Cannes or Nice with Italians and you can find great
> coffee.

We were only in Paris for a day or two. Many stops on the way their
and back through Normandy, but only the north of the country, this time.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



   
Date: 03 May 2007 12:43:22
From: I->Ian
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 03 May 2007 19:27:33 +0100, Danny
<danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote:

>I->Ian wrote:
>> On Thu, 03 May 2007 11:06:15 +0100, Danny
>> <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>1st: Coffee in France is still awful.
>>
>>
>> 1 - Paris is not France
>>
>> 2 - Hang out in Cannes or Nice with Italians and you can find great
>> coffee.
>
>We were only in Paris for a day or two. Many stops on the way their
>and back through Normandy, but only the north of the country, this time.

Normandy is about the blackest 'coffee' on the planet.


 
Date: 03 May 2007 18:52:12
From: Ken Wilson
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Have all those nice neighbourhood roasters in each paris arrondissement
gone? Sacks of green beans around the shopfront - one of those large tray
roasters in the corner all nicely painted. Espresso was french style -
but, hey, the cafetiere stuff was better than i have seen in Hants.

The "tourist" cafe are pandering to american tastes - bound to be naff.

When in France.....

er - sounds an expensive trip - but if you broke two blackbird wheels - how
come you are only going back with one? Two trips?


:-)


ken




  
Date: 05 May 2007 09:12:53
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Ken Wilson wrote:
> Have all those nice neighbourhood roasters in each paris arrondissement
> gone? Sacks of green beans around the shopfront - one of those large tray
> roasters in the corner all nicely painted. Espresso was french style -
> but, hey, the cafetiere stuff was better than i have seen in Hants.
>
> The "tourist" cafe are pandering to american tastes - bound to be naff.
>
> When in France.....
>
> er - sounds an expensive trip - but if you broke two blackbird wheels - how
> come you are only going back with one? Two trips?
>
>
> :-)
>
>
> ken
>
>

We didn't use tourist cafes in tourist areas.

Apparently the rear wheel is salvageable (although the garage was
going to order a new one since they are available). Only the front is
unavailable, hence me finding one here and returing with it.


--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



  
Date: 03 May 2007 14:50:48
From:
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 3 May 2007 18:52:12 +0100, "Ken Wilson"
<ken@kwilsonDEDUCT.fsnet.co.uk > wrote:

>Have all those nice neighbourhood roasters in each paris arrondissement
>gone? Sacks of green beans around the shopfront - one of those large tray
>roasters in the corner all nicely painted. Espresso was french style -
>but, hey, the cafetiere stuff was better than i have seen in Hants.
>
>The "tourist" cafe are pandering to american tastes - bound to be naff.
>
>When in France.....
>
>er - sounds an expensive trip - but if you broke two blackbird wheels - how
>come you are only going back with one? Two trips?
>
>
>:-)
>
>
>ken
>
We were lucky to be in Paris last year and there were indeed some
coffee sacks around the front of the shop, but it was robusta:) which
I'd never seen.

aloha,
Cea


 
Date: 03 May 2007 10:52:53
From: pltrgyst
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 03 May 2007 11:06:15 +0100, Danny
<danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote:

>1st: Coffee in France is still awful. Most can't even make a cappa,
>which is what Lucy likes...
>
>Lucy made me go to a Starbucks in Paris... She wanted to
>try the awful caramel latte thingie....undrinkable, and I have a sweet tooth....

Sounds like neither of you actally drinks coffee, so how can you
judge?

But the coming from a country where "coffee" has been traditionally
offered from two huge pots -- "black or white?" that isn't a surprise.
8;)

-- Larry



  
Date: 03 May 2007 19:26:09
From: Danny
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
pltrgyst wrote:

> Sounds like neither of you actally drinks coffee, so how can you
> judge?
>
> But the coming from a country where "coffee" has been traditionally
> offered from two huge pots -- "black or white?" that isn't a surprise.
> 8;)
>
> -- Larry
>

You really don't know me, do you. Of course I drink coffee! I don't
care much for straight espresso, although Lucy does, but my main drink
in the trailer is a strong short latte - 5oz glass with a double and
steamed milk.

--
Regards, Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
(apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)



  
Date: 03 May 2007 06:04:09
From:
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 03 May 2007 10:52:53 -0400, pltrgyst <usenet@xhost.org > wrote:

>On Thu, 03 May 2007 11:06:15 +0100, Danny
><danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com> wrote:
>
>>1st: Coffee in France is still awful. Most can't even make a cappa,
>>which is what Lucy likes...
>>
>>Lucy made me go to a Starbucks in Paris... She wanted to
>>try the awful caramel latte thingie....undrinkable, and I have a sweet tooth....
>
>Sounds like neither of you actally drinks coffee, so how can you
>judge?
>
>But the coming from a country where "coffee" has been traditionally
>offered from two huge pots -- "black or white?" that isn't a surprise.
>8;)
>
>-- Larry

I don't have to defend Danny, but he sure knows coffee, silly poster.
I agree with all, the coffee in France is terrible. My answer: bring
your own.

aloha,
Cea


 
Date: 03 May 2007 08:07:59
From: Ken Fox
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
Hope your trip was (on the whole) enjoyable, in spite of the mishaps.

I'm leaving France myself, tomorrow, after a month spent mostly in Lyon with
a bit of the time in Burgundy and some in Alsace. After a month:

Number of good meals: Many

Number of good coffees: Zero.

I just suspend my taste when it comes to coffee in France. I expect nothing
and receive less. It only makes the coffee taste better when I get home.

ken

"Danny" <danny@nospam.gaggia-espresso.com > wrote in message
news:59tqhqF2m9jgrU1@mid.individual.net...
> 1st: Coffee in France is still awful. Most can't even make a cappa, which
> is what Lucy likes - some put aerosol cream on top, one put chocolate in
> it, some made an americano with some steamed milk on top...
>
> Lucy made me go to a Starbucks in Paris (pic to follow!) She wanted to try
> the awful caramel latte thingie. The staff seemed all to be new that
> day - the guy on the counter added up the bill wrong (2 coffees and two
> croissant), in my favour, and the guy on the superauto seemed to at least
> half fill the cup with syrup before deciding he had enough. Result was
> undrinkable, and I have a sweet tooth.
>
> Had pleasant weekend in Paris, even got up the Eiffel Tower for once, and
> did the Seine boat cruise.
>
> Not so much fun coming back - hit a black line (actually a really sharp
> lump of motorway) on the A13 after a peage pay point, which wrecked both
> wheels on the Blackbird, followed by man with recovery lorry failing to
> secure bike correctly so it fell over on the way to the garage. Bike
> still in garage in Vernon, where we waited for two days for a wheel that
> never came. We negotiated trains to ferry and I've now bought a wheel to
> take back to France after their two bank holidays.....
>
>
> --
> Regards, Danny
>
> http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
> (apparently bad grammar but I like it that way...)
>




  
Date: 03 May 2007 16:51:22
From: roland
Subject: Re: coffee in France & adventure
On Thu, 3 May 2007 08:07:59 -0600, "Ken Fox"
<morceaudemerdeSnipThis@hotmail.com > wrote:

>Number of good meals: Many
>
>Number of good coffees: Zero.
>
>I just suspend my taste when it comes to coffee in France. I expect nothing
>and receive less. It only makes the coffee taste better when I get home.

Born and raised in Alsace, living in Germany for 40 years, all I can
say: you are right;-((

If a bad fate ever let you strand in my birthtown, Haguenau, treat
yourself to an express at the Café de la Gare there.
The café Richard they serve there in a room full of of tobacco fumes
will surely be on top of your "worst-coffees-ever-list".


roland
--
The Gods, who are infinite, give everything entirely to those whom they love: all joys, which are infinite, and all griefs, which are infinite - entirely.
J.W.v.Goethe